Social Security and Medicare

[bobabode]

As many here are apparently of a certain vintage...;)

"Tom Leppert, the former mayor of Dallas who, it was announced Monday, is a member of Donald Trump's "landing team" for the Social Security Administration, once released a plan calling for the privatization of Social Security and Medicare.

The "landing teams" interact with federal agencies in helping to set up the government under President-elect Trump after he is sworn into office.
Leppert, who released the plan during a failed bid for the Republican nomination for the U.S. Senate in Texas in 2012, most recently served as the CEO of Kaplan, Inc. Leppert supported Trump during the Republican primary and the president-elect thanked him at the time in a tweet.
But Leppert's past plans advocating privatizing both Social Security and Medicare make him a peculiar choice to run point on the Social Security Administration. Trump has unabashedly opposed any effort to change entitlements throughout the campaign, saying economic growth would keep entitlements from needing cuts. Emails to Leppert and Trump's spokespeople were not immediately returned.

Trump talked about entitlements earlier this year with a local Wisconsin radio station, saying, "Now, I want to get rid of waste, fraud, and abuse. I want to do a lot of things to it that are going to make it much better, actually. But I'm not going to cut it, and I'm not going to raise ages, and I'm not going to do all of the things that they want to do. But they want to really cut it, and they want to cut it very substantially, the Republicans, and I'm not going to do that."

"We're gonna save your Social Security without making any cuts. Mark my words," Trump said in February.

Yeah right, that warm yellow rain gently wafting down from atop Trump Tower on Fifth Avenue ain't manna from heaven.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ex-m-eEKsg&list=RD-ex-m-eEKsg#t=0

Read more here - http://money.cnn.com/2016/11/21/news/economy/kfile-trump-social-security/index.html?section=money_topstories

[Boreas]

As many here are apparently of a certain vintage...;)

"Tom Leppert, the former mayor of Dallas who, it was announced Monday, is a member of Donald Trump's "landing team" for the Social Security Administration, once released a plan calling for the privatization of Social Security and Medicare.

The "landing teams" interact with federal agencies in helping to set up the government under President-elect Trump after he is sworn into office.
Leppert, who released the plan during a failed bid for the Republican nomination for the U.S. Senate in Texas in 2012, most recently served as the CEO of Kaplan, Inc. Leppert supported Trump during the Republican primary and the president-elect thanked him at the time in a tweet.
But Leppert's past plans advocating privatizing both Social Security and Medicare make him a peculiar choice to run point on the Social Security Administration. Trump has unabashedly opposed any effort to change entitlements throughout the campaign, saying economic growth would keep entitlements from needing cuts. Emails to Leppert and Trump's spokespeople were not immediately returned.

Trump talked about entitlements earlier this year with a local Wisconsin radio station, saying, "Now, I want to get rid of waste, fraud, and abuse. I want to do a lot of things to it that are going to make it much better, actually. But I'm not going to cut it, and I'm not going to raise ages, and I'm not going to do all of the things that they want to do. But they want to really cut it, and they want to cut it very substantially, the Republicans, and I'm not going to do that."

"We're gonna save your Social Security without making any cuts. Mark my words," Trump said in February.

Yeah right, that warm yellow rain gently wafting down from atop Trump Tower on Fifth Avenue ain't manna from heaven.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ex-m-eEKsg&list=RD-ex-m-eEKsg#t=0

Read more here - http://money.cnn.com/2016/11/21/news/economy/kfile-trump-social-security/index.html?section=money_topstories

Social Security and Medicare are effectively dead.

[Tom Joad]

As many here are apparently of a certain vintage...;)

"Tom Leppert, the former mayor of Dallas who, it was announced Monday, is a member of Donald Trump's "landing team" for the Social Security Administration, once released a plan calling for the privatization of Social Security and Medicare.

The "landing teams" interact with federal agencies in helping to set up the government under President-elect Trump after he is sworn into office.
Leppert, who released the plan during a failed bid for the Republican nomination for the U.S. Senate in Texas in 2012, most recently served as the CEO of Kaplan, Inc. Leppert supported Trump during the Republican primary and the president-elect thanked him at the time in a tweet.
But Leppert's past plans advocating privatizing both Social Security and Medicare make him a peculiar choice to run point on the Social Security Administration. Trump has unabashedly opposed any effort to change entitlements throughout the campaign, saying economic growth would keep entitlements from needing cuts. Emails to Leppert and Trump's spokespeople were not immediately returned.

Trump talked about entitlements earlier this year with a local Wisconsin radio station, saying, "Now, I want to get rid of waste, fraud, and abuse. I want to do a lot of things to it that are going to make it much better, actually. But I'm not going to cut it, and I'm not going to raise ages, and I'm not going to do all of the things that they want to do. But they want to really cut it, and they want to cut it very substantially, the Republicans, and I'm not going to do that."

"We're gonna save your Social Security without making any cuts. Mark my words," Trump said in February.

Yeah right, that warm yellow rain gently wafting down from atop Trump Tower on Fifth Avenue ain't manna from heaven.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ex-m-eEKsg&list=RD-ex-m-eEKsg#t=0

Read more here - http://money.cnn.com/2016/11/21/news/economy/kfile-trump-social-security/index.html?section=money_topstories

Social Security and Medicare are effectively dead.

Who was just elected President of the United States?

Was it Tom Leppert?

Or was it Donald Trump?

[Tom Joad]

Social Security and Medicare are effectively dead.

So you think if worst case scenario comes true, and Trump decides to let Paul Ryan and whathisname? Leppert run the show, that the pussy Dems won't be able to scare up 41 votes in the Senate to block it, even though they have 48 seats?

You may be right about that.

The Dems are pussies.

So I'll count on Trump to save my Social Security.

[Boreas]

Who was just elected President of the United States?

Was it Tom Leppert?

Or was it Donald Trump?You watch,Joad, and find out what it means to put your faith in a liar's promises.

[bobabode]

Who said, "I'm going to hire the best people"?

I hope the elderly learn to enjoy the taste of catfood on crackers cause it surely won't be pate.

[bobabode]

You watch,Joad, and find out what it means to put your faith in a liar's promises.

It wouldn't be the first time he's been scammed. More'n likely he's got some prime land out there in the 'Glades somewheres. Hmmm, I've heard gators taste like chicken. I wonder if there's any truth to that?

[Tom Joad]

You watch,Joad, and find out what it means to put your faith in a liar's promises.

Who said, "I'm going to hire the best people"?

I hope the elderly learn to enjoy the taste of catfood on crackers cause it surely won't be pate.

You guys are fucking hilarious with your chicken little doom and gloom scenarios dancing like sugar plums all in your head. :D

[finnbow]

You guys are fucking hilarious with your chicken little doom and gloom scenarios dancing like sugar plums all in your head. :D

Meanwhile, you try to sugarcoat a neo-Nazi.

[Tom Joad]

Meanwhile, you try to sugarcoat a neo-Nazi.

You are wrong on both counts.

Number one: Trump is not a Neo-Nazi.

Number two: I'm just providing a little objectivity to counter the anti-Trump hysteria that has taken over this forum.

[finnbow]

You are wrong on both counts.

Number one: Trump is not a Neo-Nazi...

That remains to be seen. He sure did run as a proto-fascist (http://theweek.com/articles/574097/donald-trump-leading-protofascist-movement)and selected another as his closest advisor.

[merrylander]

I hope they realize what that would do to the economy - it would make the 2008 recession look like a church picnic.

[bobabode]

"WASHINGTON — Donald J. Trump once declared that campaigning for “substantial” changes to Medicare would be a political death wish.
But with Election Day behind them, emboldened House Republicans say they will move forward on a years-old effort to shift Medicare away from its open-ended commitment to pay for medical services and toward a fixed government contribution for each beneficiary.
The idea rarely came up during Mr. Trump’s march toward the White House, but a battle over the future of Medicare could roil Washington during his first year in office, whether he wants it or not."

"For nearly six years, Speaker Paul D. Ryan has championed the new approach, denounced by Democrats as “voucherizing” Medicare. Representative Tom Price of Georgia, the House Budget Committee chairman and a leading candidate to be Mr. Trump’s secretary of health and human services, has also embraced the idea, known as premium support." NY Times

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/a-battle-to-change-medicare-is-brewing-whether-trump-wants-it-or-not/ar-AAkIRb2?li=BBmkt5R&ocid=spartandhp

[CarlV]

Number two: I'm just providing a little objectivity to counter the anti-Trump hysteria that has taken over this forum.

FYI, you need to work on it a bit my friend. There is certainly no objectivity and you really do come across as a shill and nothing else.


Carl

[Tom Joad]

"WASHINGTON — Donald J. Trump once declared that campaigning for “substantial” changes to Medicare would be a political death wish.
But with Election Day behind them, emboldened House Republicans say they will move forward on a years-old effort to shift Medicare away from its open-ended commitment to pay for medical services and toward a fixed government contribution for each beneficiary.
The idea rarely came up during Mr. Trump’s march toward the White House, but a battle over the future of Medicare could roil Washington during his first year in office, whether he wants it or not."

"For nearly six years, Speaker Paul D. Ryan has championed the new approach, denounced by Democrats as “voucherizing” Medicare. Representative Tom Price of Georgia, the House Budget Committee chairman and a leading candidate to be Mr. Trump’s secretary of health and human services, has also embraced the idea, known as premium support." NY Times

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/a-battle-to-change-medicare-is-brewing-whether-trump-wants-it-or-not/ar-AAkIRb2?li=BBmkt5R&ocid=spartandhp

I don't care what "Republicans in congress" say or think.

They didn't win this election, Trump did.

Without their help as most of them did not support him.

To think that now they are going to get Carte Blanc to do whatever they want and he will rubber stamp it is naive as Hell.

[finnbow]

I don't care what "Republicans in congress" say or think.

They didn't win this election, Trump did.

Without their help as most of them did not support him.

To think that now they are going to get Carte Blanc to do whatever they want and he will rubber stamp it is naive as Hell.

Your comments assumes Trump has an ideology and really gives a shit about governance. His presidential run was never about that. From day one, it was about his brand and his ego. We'll have to see what the neo-fascist behind the curtain who's pulling Trump's strings (Bannon) has in store. BTW, Trump was walked back almost all of his campaign promises already. Why should SS and Medicare be the only things he doesn't renege on?

[Boreas]

I don't care what "Republicans in congress" say or think.

They didn't win this election, Trump did.

Without their help as most of them did not support him.

To think that now they are going to get Carte Blanc to do whatever they want and he will rubber stamp it is naive as Hell.

As much as he'd like to be and as much as you'd like him to be, Trump will not be King of America. With the Republicans in control of both houses of Congress, Trump will need their cooperation in order to govern. If they want to scrap Medicare and privatize Social Security, and they do, Trump will happily go along.

[Tom Joad]

As much as he'd like to be and as much as you'd like him to be, Trump will not be King of America. With the Republicans in control of both houses of Congress, Trump will need their cooperation in order to govern. If they want to scrap Medicare and privatize Social Security, and they do, Trump will happily go along.

We'll see.

If Trump turns out to be a working class Hero, I win.

If he turns out to be a scam artist, the Hillarybots lose. ;)

Heads I win. Tails they lose. ;)

[donquixote99]

We'll see.

If Trump turns out to be a working class Hero, I win.

If he turns out to be a scam artist, the Hillarybots lose. ;)

Heads I win. Tails they lose. ;)


You know.

I know you know. And you know that too.

All this shit is just your way to try to cope.

[Boreas]

You know.

I know you know. And you know that too.

All this shit is just your way to try to cope.

Cognitive dissonance, just like everyone that supports Trump..... or so I'd like to believe but I know too well that there are many out there who like what he stands for just fine.

[Tom Joad]

You know.

I know you know. And you know that too.

All this shit is just your way to try to cope.

It is.

As far as politics goes, the world ended the day I realized that Hillary Clinton was going to be nominated and not Bernie.

Everything else since then has been my way of saying "Fuck it"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2RJH7GdvjP0

[finnbow]

We'll see.

If Trump turns out to be a working class Hero, I win.

If he turns out to be a scam artist, the Hillarybots lose. ;)

Heads I win. Tails they lose. ;)

What do you mean "if?" Dude's a grifter from the word "go." I guess you're just a bit slow on the uptake. Hell, he still has 75 lawsuits against him (http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2016/10/25/pending-lawsuits-donald-trump-presidency/92666382/) in America's courts.

[BlueStreak]

You are wrong on both counts.

Number one: Trump is not a Neo-Nazi.

Number two: I'm just providing a little objectivity to counter the anti-Trump hysteria that has taken over this forum.

What you're seeing here IS objectivity. We all want the country to succeed. But, there is a price to pay for this so-called "Greatness" that some seem to seek. Historically, leaders who bellow the loudest about greatness and extoll the virtues of nationalistic and patriotic fervor turn out to be a nightmare and ultimately bring nothing but shame.

The cause for concern is not unfounded.

Go ahead, tell me you don't know this is true.

[Tom Joad]

What do you mean "if?" Dude's a grifter from the word "go." I guess you're just a bit slow on the uptake. Hell, he still has 75 lawsuits against him (http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2016/10/25/pending-lawsuits-donald-trump-presidency/92666382/) in America's courts.

What you're seeing here IS objectivity. We all want the country to succeed. But, there is a price to pay for this so-called "Greatness" that some seem to seek. Historically, leaders who bellow the loudest about greatness and extoll the virtues of nationalistic and patriotic fervor turn out to be a nightmare and ultimately bring nothing but shame.

The cause for concern is not unfounded.

Go ahead, tell me you don't know this is true.

Don has helped me see the light.

Now that I understand myself better, things are going to be a lot easier from now on

Fuck it.

[whell]

That remains to be seen. He sure did run as a proto-fascist (http://theweek.com/articles/574097/donald-trump-leading-protofascist-movement)and selected another as his closest advisor.

Good Lord. I thought we dispatched that "proto-fascist" talk track in another thread. I'll give you this much, Finn: you're obviously a fan of recycling, and you're obviously a fan of William James, who famously said: "There's nothing so absurd that if you repeat it often enough, people will believe it."

[finnbow]

Good Lord. I thought we dispatched that "proto-fascist" talk track in another thread. I'll give you this much, Finn: you're obviously a fan of recycling, and you're obviously a fan of William James, who famously said: "There's nothing so absurd that if you repeat it often enough, people will believe it."

I understand your unwillingness and inability to grasp that you voted for such a dangerous cretin.

[whell]

Social Security and Medicare are one of the largest pyramid schemes of all time. They didn't start out that way. But that's what they've become as they've been blown by Washington political winds over the years. The pyramid will begin to crumble during Trump's administration, according the latest annual report (https://www.ssa.gov/policy/trust-funds-summary.html) of the Social Security Board of Trustees:

"The Trustees project that the combined OASDI Trust Funds will continue growing through 2019 as total annual income exceeds total annual costs. Beginning in 2020, however, they project the OASDI annual cost will exceed total income, so the trust fund reserves will be drawn down until they are depleted in 2034—the same year as estimated last year. After trust fund reserve depletion, continuing income is sufficient to pay 79 percent of program cost, declining to 74 percent for 2090."

The attitude of "it ain't broke, so don't fix it" regarding SSA always strikes me as shamelessly self serving, since by 2034 most of us might not be around to argue about it any more. But my kids sure will, and I'll be damned if I'm going to live in well and then stick my kids with the bill. This financial albatross needs to get fixed, and soon.

[whell]

I understand your unwillingness and inability to grasp that you voted for such a dangerous cretin.

Still waiting for you - for several days now - to provide one self-sourced example to support your claim that Pence and Trump are "mainstreaming" neo-Nazi-ism. But I'll be patient.

[finnbow]

Still waiting for you - for several days now - to provide one self-sourced example to support your claim that Pence and Trump are "mainstreaming" neo-Nazi-ism. But I'll be patient.

There are hundreds of examples nationwide that you are obviously intentionally blind to. If you're truly interested, find them yourself. For starters, however, I'll give you Richard Spencer and his merry band of neo-Nazis who met to celebrate Trump's victory in the Ronald Reagan building (https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/lets-party-like-its-1933-inside-the-disturbing-alt-right-world-of-richard-spencer/2016/11/22/cf81dc74-aff7-11e6-840f-e3ebab6bcdd3_story.html?hpid=hp_no-name_hp-in-the-news%3Apage%2Fin-the-news), a Federal building on Pennsylvania avenue a couple of blocks from the White House. Then spend a few days on Breitbart.com to better understand the political philosophy of Trump's foremost political advisor, Steve Bannon (whose first choice of puppet to install (with Russia's help (https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/americans-keep-looking-away-from-the-elections-most-alarming-story/2016/11/25/83533d3e-b0e2-11e6-8616-52b15787add0_story.html?tid=pm_pop&utm_term=.366679fa67dd)) and manipulate as President was Sarah Palin). Trump was his second choice who he described as a "blunt instrument (https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/for-trump-adviser-stephen-bannon-fiery-populism-followed-life-in-elite-circles/2016/11/19/de91ef40-ac57-11e6-977a-1030f822fc35_story.html)" to implement his white-nationalist agenda.

I understand your desire to ignore these things in favor of believing that Trump is indeed the only guy who can fix the country (itself symptomatic of fascism). If you find staying ignorant to be blissful, knock yourself out. The Germans were also blissful about Hitler for almost a decade ... until they weren't.

[whell]

There are hundreds of examples nationwide that you are obviously intentionally blind to. If you're truly interested, find them yourself.

You could have saved yourself a lot of typing and copy/pasting and just said "I don't know", or "I don't have any quotes that support my statement".

[whell]

The Germans were also blissful about Hitler for almost a decade ... until they weren't.

...and, of course, what would a liberal verbal assault on a Republican politician be without at least one "Hitler reference."

Keep it up, Finn. You're on your way to becoming a caricature.

https://scontent.cdninstagram.com/hphotos-xpa1/t51.2885-15/e15/11245556_1662744680635168_1330415431_n.jpg

[finnbow]

...and, of course, what would a liberal verbal assault on a Republican politician be without at least one "Hitler reference."

For the record, I supported Kasich from the beginning. You can continue to deny what Trump/Bannon represent if it helps you sleep at night.

[whell]

You can continue to deny what Trump/Bannon represent if it helps you sleep at night.

I probably will, just 'cuz it makes you look silly. By the way, the WaPo article on Bannon that you linked to contradicts your position. But hey, don't let the facts get in your way. :rolleyes:

[finnbow]

I probably will, just 'cuz it makes you look silly. By the way, the WaPo article on Bannon that you linked to contradicts your position. But hey, don't let the facts get in your way. :rolleyes:

It doesn't at all contradict the notion that Bannon is the man behind the curtain using Trump as the vehicle to implement his (white-)nationalist agenda. In fact, it's pretty much the point of the article.

[bobabode]

Still waiting for you - for several days now - to provide one self-sourced example to support your claim that Pence and Trump are "mainstreaming" neo-Nazi-ism. But I'll be patient.

Feelin' your oats, eh Whell? :rolleyes: Have you taken a look at Bannon?

[whell]

Feelin' your oats, eh Whell? :rolleyes: Have you taken a look at Bannon?

Sure. He's latest incarnation of Karl Rove for the left. In other words, he's the left's latest bogeyman, and I'm sure you guys will conjure up many more over the next 4 years. :rolleyes:

[finnbow]

Sure. He's latest incarnation of Karl Rove for the left. In other words, he's the left's latest bogeyman, and I'm sure you guys will conjure up many more over the next 4 years. :rolleyes:

Not hardly. Rove falls within the bounds of normal political behavior/discourse. Bannon, OTOH, doesn't come close. However, your conflation of Rove criticism with Bannon criticism illustrates my point that Trump/Bannon have mainstreamed racism, xenophobia and misogyny.

[Tom Joad]

Here's an example of the chickenshit that passes for journalism from the IN THE TANK FOR CLINTON media. I'm just going to focus on what the dipshit author wrote about Medicare, since that's what this thread is about.

http://www.commondreams.org/views/2016/11/27/already-big-gap-between-trumps-promises-middle-class-and-his-policies

Americans value Medicare and Medicaid very highly, and rightly so. Millions rely on these programs for health care during tough times (Medicaid) and in retirement (Medicare), and about 40 percent of long-term care in the country is provided by Medicaid. During the campaign, Trump made clear promises to protect these programs from budget cuts. The question going forward, however, is did we elect President Donald Trump or President Paul Ryan?

Are you fucking shitting me? "The question going forward, however, is did we elect President Donald Trump or President Paul Ryan?" Jesus Christ Almighty.:rolleyes:

TRUMP IS THE GODDAMNED PRESIDENT MORON!

And then there's this shit:

It may be that Trump really does not want to cut these programs. But the question is whether or not he’s attentive and shrewd enough to stop congressional Republicans from doing so.

Attentive or shrewd enough? Trump has just gotten finished making fools of the entire Republican and Democratic establishment. And this idiot is suggesting that he's not smart enough to use his Veto power? :rolleyes:

[MrPots]

...and, of course, what would a liberal verbal assault on a Republican politician be without at least one "Hitler reference."

Keep it up, Finn. You're on your way to becoming a caricature.

https://scontent.cdninstagram.com/hphotos-xpa1/t51.2885-15/e15/11245556_1662744680635168_1330415431_n.jpg

If republican politicians did not so embody racism, bigotry and fascism perhaps it would be considered assault, but since republicans pretty much embrace those "values", it's nothing but the truth.

[finnbow]

...Attentive or shrewd enough? Trump has just gotten finished making fools of the entire Republican and Democratic establishment. And this idiot is suggesting that he's not smart enough to use his Veto power? :rolleyes:

The issue really is whether Trump has any intention of implementing anything he ran on. He's flip-flopped on nearly everything already.

[donquixote99]

Here's an example of the chickenshit that passes for journalism from the IN THE TANK FOR CLINTON media. I'm just going to focus on what the dipshit author wrote about Medicare, since that's what this thread is about.

http://www.commondreams.org/views/2016/11/27/already-big-gap-between-trumps-promises-middle-class-and-his-policies



Are you fucking shitting me? "The question going forward, however, is did we elect President Donald Trump or President Paul Ryan?" Jesus Christ Almighty.:rolleyes:

TRUMP IS THE GODDAMNED PRESIDENT MORON!

And then there's this shit:



Attentive or shrewd enough? Trump has just gotten finished making fools of the entire Republican and Democratic establishment. And this idiot is suggesting that he's not smart enough to use his Veto power? :rolleyes:

Power resides where men think it resides. Screaming from you will have very little effect.

Trumop is smart enough to use the veto (probably). But will he see it in his interest to do so? Because that is the question.

The only question.

[whell]

If republican politicians did not so embody racism, bigotry and fascism perhaps it would be considered assault, but since republicans pretty much embrace those "values", it's nothing but the truth.

Right. I go out of my way to elect racists, bigots and fascists. I demand to see those qualities on their political resumes before I vote for anyone for elected office. :rolleyes:

[whell]

The issue really is whether Trump has any intention of implementing anything he ran on. He's flip-flopped on nearly everything already.

Trump is a straight arrow when compared to Barry on flips.

I came across this (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/02/24/AR2008022402094.html?sid=ST2008022402134) a couple weeks ago in WaPo, dated Feb 2008. It talks about his flip flops during his campaign and gets even funnier when you compare these to what he did during his 8 years. For example:

The Cuba embargo In January 2004, Obama said it was time "to end the embargo with Cuba" because it had "utterly failed in the effort to overthrow Castro." Speaking to a Cuban American audience in Miami in August 2007, he said he would not "take off the embargo" as president because it is "an important inducement for change."

Maybe, like Hillary, the Bamster has his "public and private positions" on issues. :rolleyes:

But no flip flop by any president or president elect will ever compare to the one of the biggest whoppers of all time:

"'If you like your health care plan, you can keep it." That one was even voted "Lie of the Year (http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2013/dec/12/lie-year-if-you-like-your-health-care-plan-keep-it/)", and I'd suggest that was being kind.

[Tom Joad]

"'If you like your health care plan, you can keep it." That one was even voted "Lie of the Year (http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2013/dec/12/lie-year-if-you-like-your-health-care-plan-keep-it/)", and I'd suggest that was being kind.
I liked my Health Plan.

So I kept it.

And my premiums have only gone up 60% since Obummercare was passed. Co-pays and deductibles have gone up too.

Thanks Obummer!

[BlueStreak]

There are hundreds of examples nationwide that you are obviously intentionally blind to. If you're truly interested, find them yourself. For starters, however, I'll give you Richard Spencer and his merry band of neo-Nazis who met to celebrate Trump's victory in the Ronald Reagan building (https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/lets-party-like-its-1933-inside-the-disturbing-alt-right-world-of-richard-spencer/2016/11/22/cf81dc74-aff7-11e6-840f-e3ebab6bcdd3_story.html?hpid=hp_no-name_hp-in-the-news%3Apage%2Fin-the-news), a Federal building on Pennsylvania avenue a couple of blocks from the White House. Then spend a few days on Breitbart.com to better understand the political philosophy of Trump's foremost political advisor, Steve Bannon (whose first choice of puppet to install (with Russia's help (https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/americans-keep-looking-away-from-the-elections-most-alarming-story/2016/11/25/83533d3e-b0e2-11e6-8616-52b15787add0_story.html?tid=pm_pop&utm_term=.366679fa67dd)) and manipulate as President was Sarah Palin). Trump was his second choice who he described as a "blunt instrument (https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/for-trump-adviser-stephen-bannon-fiery-populism-followed-life-in-elite-circles/2016/11/19/de91ef40-ac57-11e6-977a-1030f822fc35_story.html)" to implement his white-nationalist agenda.

I understand your desire to ignore these things in favor of believing that Trump is indeed the only guy who can fix the country (itself symptomatic of fascism). If you find staying ignorant to be blissful, knock yourself out. The Germans were also blissful about Hitler for almost a decade ... until they weren't.

You could have saved yourself a lot of typing and copy/pasting and just said "I don't know", or "I don't have any quotes that support my statement".

"The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world that he doesn't exist.". (Don't recall who said that.)

These people are real, Mike. They exist and they are right wingers.

Remember when Sam Giancana tried to claim there was no such thing as the Mafia? He was full of shit. More recently, Frank Ancona tried to claim the Klan isn't racist. He's full of shit too.

Trying to claim there is nothing racist about these characters, at least one of whom has identified himself as a leader of the "alt-right", are not white supremacists is absurd.

As I've been saying for years; "They can't keep a lid on it forever.".

It's becoming obvious what the far right of the Republican Party is all about. More obvious with each passing day.

[whell]

It's becoming obvious what the far right of the Republican Party is all about. More obvious with each passing day.

You're just catching on? Hell, the Republicans have been branded by the left as the home of fascism and racism for years now. C'mon, get with the program! :rolleyes:

[BlueStreak]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=4&v=LrKC4syl9d4

Hear all of the arguments this Republican candidate for State Senate and former KKK Grand Wizard uses to prove he isn't a racist?

They're the same arguments we hear coming from the right all day long.

Think that's a coincidence? I don't.

[BlueStreak]

You're just catching on? Hell, the Republicans have been branded by the left as the home of fascism and racism for years now. C'mon, get with the program! :rolleyes:

That's because they are.

[BlueStreak]

You're the one who needs to "...get with the program!". Oh, I see you are. My bad.

[whell]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=4&v=LrKC4syl9d4

Hear all of the arguments this Republican candidate for State Senate and former KKK Grand Wizard uses to prove he isn't a racist?

They're the same arguments we hear coming from the right all day long.

Think that's a coincidence? I don't.

All day long? Really? I sure don't hear it, but maybe you're tuned to an extra special frequency that I'm not.

Meanwhile, Bill Clinton can say to Ted Kennedy: “A few years ago, he (Barack Obama) would have been getting us coffee.” But that doesn't bother you.

Hillary Clinton can call her campaign manager an "f*cking Jew bastard.” No worries there, huh? Hillary can engage in "lame attempts at humor" when joking about Mahatma Gandhi running a gas station in St. Louis. A perfectly understandable and excusable gaffe, right?

Jessie Jackson can famously call New York "Hymie-town". No big deal.

Joe Biden thought it was remarkable that Barack Obama was "the first mainstream African-American who is articulate and bright and clean and a nice-looking guy". So what? Or what about when he told an Indian - American supporter that "you cannot go to a 7-Eleven or a Dunkin’ Donuts unless you have a slight Indian accent. I’m not joking." Ah, that's just Joe being Joe, right?

How about good ol' Harry Reid observing that Obama was a ‘light-skinned’ African American with no Negro dialect, unless he wanted to have one. Maybe Harry was just having problems with his glasses that day...or his hearing....or something.

“I’ll have those n**gers voting Democratic for the next 200 years.” – Lyndon B. Johnson. Ah, so what. That was years ago.

I think your indignation is...um...a bit selective.

[Boreas]

"The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world that he doesn't exist.". (Don't recall who said that.)



Verbal Kint/Kaiser Soze

[merrylander]

But no flip flop by any president or president elect will ever compare to the one of the biggest whoppers of all time:

"'If you like your health care plan, you can keep it." That one was even voted "Lie of the Year (http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2013/dec/12/lie-year-if-you-like-your-health-care-plan-keep-it/)", and I'd suggest that was being kind.

Sorry Mike but we kept ours, if CareFirst had not been there her hospital bills would have had me out on the street. Still got my coverage and since she died hers was closed but even over a year later people are still trying to bill me. The rise in premiums has been under 5% per year

Best healthcare in the world my arse.

[whell]

Sorry Mike but we kept ours, if CareFirst had not been there her hospital bills would have had me out on the street. Still got my coverage and since she died hers was closed but even over a year later people are still trying to bill me. The rise in premiums has been under 5% per year

Best healthcare in the world my arse.

Congratulations. You're one of the few....

[donquixote99]

Congratulations. You're one of the few....

Backup, please.

Please link to data showing that only a 'few' persons, having a health plan before the beginning of the Affordable care Act, had the option to keep said plan.

Honest data. No fake news.

[finnbow]

Congratulations. You're one of the few....

I kept exactly the same plan and doctors.

[Tom Joad]

Sorry Mike but we kept ours, if CareFirst had not been there her hospital bills would have had me out on the street. Still got my coverage and since she died hers was closed but even over a year later people are still trying to bill me. The rise in premiums has been under 5% per year

Best healthcare in the world

"Less than 5%"?

Really?


http://www.wbaltv.com/article/carefirst-asking-for-higher-rate-increase/7102295

Maryland's largest health-insurance provider has upped its rate-increase request with the state.

The rate consumers pay for health insurance isn't a random number set by an executive. It's settled on after a complicated process between the state and insurers every year.

During a hearing on the matter Monday before the Maryland Insurance Administration, the CEO of CareFirst defended his company's revised May filing for insurance plans people buy under the Affordable Care Act.

For individual plans, for example, CareFirst now wants to charge 27.8 percent more for its HMO and 36.6 percent more for its PPO. That's on top of an average 22.9 percent rate increase from the year before, and it tops nearly all other rate changes proposed by carriers in Maryland's individual market.

[bobabode]

"President-elect Donald Trump’s choices for health secretary and administrator of the government’s largest health insurance programs have for years pursued a sharply conservative agenda that includes redefining Medicare, placing “personal responsibility” requirements on low-income recipients of Medicaid, and dismantling the Affordable Care Act.
If adopted, this agenda could dramatically alter access to insurance and medical services for more than 100 million Americans covered through the two entitlement programs and the ACA." WaPo

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/trump-turns-to-conservative-tacticians-to-run-hhs-and-entitlement-programs/2016/11/29/d0af2aec-b656-11e6-a677-b608fbb3aaf6_story.html?hpid=hp_hp-top-table-main_healthcare815p%3Ahomepage%2Fstory&utm_term=.5e8f54f51a62

An arch-Tea Partyist in charge HHS. Grab your ankles and cough. :p

[bobabode]

I kept exactly the same plan and doctors.

Heh, me too. Seems like our friend Whell has fallen for the party line, hook and sinker.

[merrylander]

"Less than 5%"?

Really?


http://www.wbaltv.com/article/carefirst-asking-for-higher-rate-increase/7102295

Yes Tom Really, WBAL TV is just another FOX news bunch of republicans. I am going from $369/mo this year to $382 next year.

[merrylander]

Don't know why y'all are worried can't fuck up healthcare here much more that they have already.

[Tom Joad]

Yes Tom Really, WBAL TV is just another FOX news bunch of republicans. I am going from $369/mo this year to $382 next year.

All I have to do is type in "Care first rate increase Maryland" and a whole shit load of sources say the same thing.

Here are just a few of many.

You may be insulated from this as you are probably in some kind of group plan, but the poor schmucks that are having to buy policies on the Obummercare exchanges are getting hammered.

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/opinion/oped/bs-ed-carefirst-rates-20160811-story.html

http://www.bizjournals.com/baltimore/news/2016/07/27/carefirst-ups-insurance-rate-increase-request-for.html

http://www.consumerhealthfirst.org/home/2016/8/17/carefirst-defends-revised-rate-increase-requests-amid-public-opposition

[ZeroJunk]

The middle class got their ass spanked with Obamacare.

Probably the single largest reason the Democrats lost so much ground in the last eight years.


Luckily the bimbo Pelosi is staying in, so I am sure she will get the Democrats back in favor with the working class.

[merrylander]

All I have to do is type in "Care first rate increase Maryland" and a whole shit load of sources say the same thing.

Here are just a few of many.

You may be insulated from this as you are probably in some kind of group plan, but the poor schmucks that are having to buy policies on the Obummercare exchanges are getting hammered.



No group but individual, Florence searched it out after I retired and we lost the company plan. Could have kept the company with COBRA - they call it that because it will bite you on the arse.

Had a lady call me about insurance after the ACA was passed, told her what I had and what it cost. She said stick with it you would be crazy to change.

Canada was 0.8% on my taxable income plus $54/mo family plan in Ontario and for healthcare better than here.:rolleyes:

[Tom Joad]

Canada was 0.8% on my taxable income plus $54/mo family plan in Ontario and for healthcare better than here.:rolleyes:

I know.

And that's what we should have here.

I still can't understand why someone as familiar with the Canadian system as you are would support Hillary Clinton over Bernie Sanders. :confused:

[nailer]

I know.

And that's what we should have here.

I still can't understand why someone as familiar with the Canadian system as you are would support Hillary Clinton over Bernie Sanders. :confused:

Sheep being used by their shepherds.

[icenine]

Sanders screwed you guys over and gave you Trump. You can whine all you want about "crooked" Hillary but in his heart of hearts Sanders knew it was over after New York but he just had to "carry on" till the convention to prove a point. Now the United States is further than ever from single payer thanks to Sanders. If Sanders was so great why could he not convince me? And by extension millions of others like me.

Oh have a nice day Bernie Bros have I made you guys upset? Get over it.

[merrylander]

I know.

And that's what we should have here.

I still can't understand why someone as familiar with the Canadian system as you are would support Hillary Clinton over Bernie Sanders. :confused:

Because Bernie had about the chance of a snowball in hell of instituting SinglePayer. Americans won't go for it because they think it is soci@lism. Mind you most Americans would not recognize a soci@laist if one bit them on the arse.

[icenine]

Because Bernie had about the chance of a snowball in hell of instituting SinglePayer. Americans won't go for it because they think it is soci@lism. Mind you most Americans would not recognize a soci@laist if one bit them on the arse.

And now thanks to Bernie we don't even have a shot at public option much less single payer.

Thanks Bernie.

[Tom Joad]

Sanders screwed you guys over and gave you Trump.

I'm fine with that. Trump was my no. 2 choice after Bernie.

If Sanders was so great why could he not convince me? And by extension millions of others like me.

http://i843.photobucket.com/albums/zz359/Dog_of_the_Earth/17vp8p.jpg (http://s843.photobucket.com/user/Dog_of_the_Earth/media/17vp8p.jpg.html)

Oh have a nice day Bernie Bros have I made you guys upset? Get over it.

Trump is the President. Get over it.

:D

[merrylander]

I'm fine with that. Trump was my no. 2 choice after Bernie.



http://i843.photobucket.com/albums/zz359/Dog_of_the_Earth/17vp8p.jpg (http://s843.photobucket.com/user/Dog_of_the_Earth/media/17vp8p.jpg.html)



Trump is the President. Get over it.

:D

We have gotten over it - the 64 dollar question is will America get over it or will the Democrats have to come in and clean out the stables again. Maybe we need another Hercules.:p

[MrPots]

The middle class got their ass spanked with Obamacare.
.

That spanking is going to seem like fun after the pineapple rape Don is going to do to the middle class.

[donquixote99]

...and, of course, what would a liberal verbal assault on a Republican politician be without at least one "Hitler reference."

Well, few would deny that Hitler was a fascist...as is Trump.

In 1995, Umberto Eco, the late Italian intellectual giant and novelist most famous for The Name of the Rose, wrote a guide describing the primary features of fascism. As a child, Eco was a loyalist of Mussolini, an experience that made him quick to detect the markers of fascism later in life, when he became a revered public intellectual and political voice. Eco noted that fascism looks different in each incarnation, morphing with time and leadership, as “it would be difficult for [it] to reappear in the same form in different historical circumstances.” It is a movement without “quintessence." Instead, it’s a sort of “fuzzy totalitarianism, a collage of different philosophical and political ideas, a beehive of contradictions,” he wrote.

Eco's famous 14-point list outlines what the author dubbed “Ur-Fascism, or Eternal Fascism”—and it fits hand in glove the political persona created by Donald Trump. Hours after 60 million Americans voted to give the presidency to a dangerously incompetent narcissist whose campaign was based on nativist fear-mongering and racist appeals, British historian Simon Schama lamented that Trump’s newly sealed win would “hearten fascists all over the world.” Sure enough, congratulations poured in from far-right admirers around the world, who recognized Trump as one of their ilk.

Throughout the campaign, comparisons of Trump to fascist leaders have been treated as unserious and even irresponsible. Now, as we watch him assemble a cabinet of frightening far-right nationalists, white supremacists, militarists, and free-marketeers, Eco’s list emerges as a must-read.

read on here: Trump Is an Eerily Perfect Match With a Famous 14-Point Guide to Identify Fascist Leaders (http://www.alternet.org/election-2016/trump-eerily-perfect-match-famous-14-point-guide-identify-fascist-leaders)

[whell]

Backup, please.

Please link to data showing that only a 'few' persons, having a health plan before the beginning of the Affordable care Act, had the option to keep said plan.

Honest data. No fake news.

Grandfathered plans are those that existed prior to the implementation of Obamacare. Those where the "if you like your plan you an keep it" plans. Many insurers decided as early on that they would phase these plans out. They weren't required to continue offering them, and it made more economic sense for the carrier to offer a single suite of plans rather than maintaining two platforms: one for grandfathered plans and another for non-grandfathered plans. That was the big news a few years back with individuals receiving cancellation notices on their policies.

For carriers that maintained grandfathered plans, they started to heat up the premiums on them so employers and individuals would choose to move off those plans. Factor in age banded pricing in the individual and small group markets, and the pricing for many of those plans really heated up.

Carriers have continued to phase them out, slowed a bit by some transitional relief provided by HHS, allowing "grandmothered" plans (pnon-ACA compliant plans that some people enrolled in between March 2010 and October 2013) to renew up until October 1, 2016 and remain in force as late as September 30, 2017. There weren't that many folks that hung on to those plans anyway, since it was left up to states whether to allow the grandmothered plans to stick around, and many states decided not to participate in the transitional relief and dumped those plans at the end of 2013.

Once that transitional relief runs out, those plans will be gone. That means that there may still be a handful of grandfathered plans still out there in the individual or group markets. If so, folks are paying through the nose for them, and that - as Finn likes to say - just isn't sustainable.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2013/dec/12/lie-year-if-you-like-your-health-care-plan-keep-it/

http://acasignups.net/16/03/24/how-many-grandfathered-or-transitional-plans-are-still-around-anyway

https://www.verywell.com/things-you-need-to-know-about-grandfathered-health-plans-3886397

[Oerets]

Little will improve our healthcare system until a comprehensive overhaul of the costs are addressed. Little chance of that happening until the greedy b@sterds suck us dry.

Other countries are able to negotiate rates with positive results, not this country!

Barney

[MrPots]

Little will improve our healthcare system until a comprehensive overhaul of the costs are addressed. Little chance of that happening until the greedy b@sterds suck us dry.

Other countries are able to negotiate rates with positive results, not this country!

Barney

Yup...

[Dondilion]

Well, few would deny that Hitler was a fascist...as is Trump.



read on here: Trump Is an Eerily Perfect Match With a Famous 14-Point Guide to Identify Fascist Leaders (http://www.alternet.org/election-2016/trump-eerily-perfect-match-famous-14-point-guide-identify-fascist-leaders)

In the Comment section: Mikekrohde lays down some awesome observations--one of which..."we will to do better than call people names to change this dynamic".

[donquixote99]

In the Comment section: Mikekrohde lays down some awesome observations--one of which..."we will to do better than call people names to change this dynamic".

Meh. Just a rant that says 'sure trump's full of shit but YOU are full of more shit." Disagree with many of his points. And it's a lot easier to say 'we have to do better' than to make any actual proposals for what 'better' might be.

Guys with his bundle of attitudes will just sit around and throw stones at any ideas for 'better' that come along....

The most 'better' we can hope for right now is it's 'better' if we can limit the damage. That involves understanding how bad the damage can get.

How bad it get was shown in an op-ed in the Trump-owned NY Observer (http://observer.com/2016/12/comeys-fbi-needs-to-investigate-violent-democratic-tantrums/). The writer posits a wide and deep conspiracy behind protests against Trump, Black Lives Matter, and the recount efforts. George Soros is mentioned, and it's suggested that the FBI start investigating everyone in sight. In other words, the FBI becomes, blatantly, the 'political police,' and dissent in criminalized.

This in the paper owned by Ivanka Trump's husband. Red flag.

[Tom Joad]

Little will improve our healthcare system until a comprehensive overhaul of the costs are addressed. Little chance of that happening until the greedy b@sterds suck us dry.

Other countries are able to negotiate rates with positive results, not this country!

Barney

This is true.

Doctors, hospitals, drug companies, medical supply providers, etc. all grossly overcharge for their goods and services. And our bought and paid for Politicians enable them.

[Tom Joad]

http://www.sanders.senate.gov/newsroom/press-releases/senate-republicans-block-trump-proposal-to-lower-prescription-drug-prices

WASHINGTON, Dec. 6 – Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) proposed an amendment Tuesday to lower the cost of prescription drugs by letting Medicare negotiate drug prices and allowing for the importation from other countries of low-cost prescription drugs – both proposals advocated by President-elect Donald Trump.

Republicans blocked the Sanders amendment.

continue (http://www.sanders.senate.gov/newsroom/press-releases/senate-republicans-block-trump-proposal-to-lower-prescription-drug-prices)

[nailer]

http://www.sanders.senate.gov/newsroom/press-releases/senate-republicans-block-trump-proposal-to-lower-prescription-drug-prices



continue (http://www.sanders.senate.gov/newsroom/press-releases/senate-republicans-block-trump-proposal-to-lower-prescription-drug-prices)

If Trump is the guy you want him to be this is the type of issue he could use to build a working coalition when the new Congress is seated.

[donquixote99]

IF

big if

[Tom Joad]

IF

big if

Of course it's an IF.

Just like it is with any elected official before they take office.

Unlike the bots here, I'm not writing him off prematurely.