PDA

View Full Version : The Prez, The Poles, & Polish Americans


djv8ga
05-29-2012, 10:32 PM
What a Meathead. :rolleyes:
http://news.yahoo.com/president-obama-causes-outrage-reference-polish-death-camp-002228231--abc-news-politics.html

piece-itpete
05-30-2012, 08:19 AM
It's not that big of a mistake in reality I think but perception sure matters. Our CinC should know that. The Poles are staunch allies of the US.

Pete

d-ray657
05-30-2012, 08:36 AM
So they are upset about the use of less than precise language in the process of honoring a Polish freedom fighter. Whatever happened to actions speak louder than words.

Regards,

D-Ray

merrylander
05-30-2012, 09:10 AM
Sorry but with all due respect there were some Polish people complicit in sending Jews to those camps. That came out at the end of WW II and I remember th news reports at the time. That does not mean that all Polish citizens were guilty, but they need to remember history.

finnbow
05-30-2012, 09:56 AM
Sorry but with all due respect there were some Polish people complicit in sending Jews to those camps. That came out at the end of WW II and I remember th news reports at the time. That does not mean that all Polish citizens were guilty, but they need to remember history.

Indeed. In fact, there were a bunch of Poles in Nazi uniforms defending the shores of Normandy in 1944 as well as on the Eastern front. In all, there were nearly 225,000 Poles in the Wehrmacht (German army). A number of countries have gone to great to gloss over their complicity with the Germans in WWII.

noonereal
05-30-2012, 09:58 AM
What a Meathead. :rolleyes:
http://news.yahoo.com/president-obama-causes-outrage-reference-polish-death-camp-002228231--abc-news-politics.html

OMG. Talk about nothing.

Now if he though the death camps were run by Poland that would make him a republican presidential candidate wouldn't it?

d-ray657
05-30-2012, 10:04 AM
Indeed. In fact, there were a bunch of Poles in Nazi uniforms defending the shores of Normandy in 1944 as well as on the Eastern front. In all, there were nearly 225,000 Poles in the Wehrmacht (German army). A number of countries have gone to great to gloss over their complicity with the Germans in WWII.

Perhaps that, rather than Obama's words, is the real source of discomfort.

Regards,

D-Ray

piece-itpete
05-30-2012, 10:19 AM
There are quislings everywhere, and there were quite a few German Poles before the war. I thought Poland was considered one of the least complicit.

And the millions that didn't collaborate (the ones that executed many many collaborators after the war, at least the collaborators that didn't move (run) to Germany) might, just might not want to painted with the 11 to 17 million people the Nazis killed in those camps.

But to cover a minor Obama slip, the Poles are all Jewkillers? Come now.

Pete

d-ray657
05-30-2012, 10:49 AM
Maybe you have a point there, Pete. But the level of overreaction is puzzling, particular when considering the context of the comment. Obama was honoring a hero of the Polish resistance. That's kind of like saying that a preacher is being pornographic when he says that Jesus rode into town on an ass.

Regards,

D-Ray

merrylander
05-30-2012, 10:52 AM
There are quislings everywhere, and there were quite a few German Poles before the war. I thought Poland was considered one of the least complicit.

And the millions that didn't collaborate (the ones that executed many many collaborators after the war, at least the collaborators that didn't move (run) to Germany) might, just might not want to painted with the 11 to 17 million people the Nazis killed in those camps.

But to cover a minor Obama slip, the Poles are all Jewkillers? Come now.

Pete

No one said they all were, the camps were located in Poland, an easy enough slip to make.

barbara
05-30-2012, 11:28 AM
As far as the televised news is concerned, Romney being trumped by the Donald quickly overshadowed obama's slip of the tongue.

JJIII
05-30-2012, 12:12 PM
As far as the televised news is concerned, Romney being trumped by the Donald quickly overshadowed obama's slip of the tongue.

Now there is a surprise.:)

Zeke
05-30-2012, 04:11 PM
Perhaps that, rather than Obama's words, is the real source of discomfort.

Regards,

D-Ray

There were Native scouts with Custer (who, by the way, told him "run").

History is what it is.

I don't perceive any Presidential malice here. Just like when Bush stood in front of a "Mission Accomplished" banner (which was the carrier's, not his), it's been blown out of proportion.

BlueStreak
05-30-2012, 04:27 PM
Uh, folks, when Germany occupied Poland, there wasn't exactly a massive groundswell of of support for the Jewish community from other Poles. They largely stayed out of the way as the Nazis filled up the cattlecars bound for Treblinka (Located in Poland) and elsewhere................

I'm just sayin'.

As I see it, referring to "....a Polish deathcamp..." was faux pas at worst.

Dave

bobabode
05-30-2012, 06:24 PM
Uh, folks, when Germany occupied Poland, there wasn't exactly a massive groundswell of of support for the Jewish community from other Poles. They largely stayed out of the way as the Nazis filled up the cattlecars bound for Treblinka (Located in Poland) and elsewhere................

I'm just sayin'.

As I see it, referring to "....a Polish deathcamp..." was faux pas at worst.

Dave

Yep. Much ado about nothing. Political grasping at straws is how I see it. Thanks, DJ.:rolleyes:

Arkay
06-04-2012, 11:18 AM
There is such rampant distortion in the re-writing of history sometimes, it makes me sick.

You're saying that there were a few Polish people complicit in Nazi enforcement of death camps, and somehow Poles should be thrown in with Nazis in the persecution of Jews, and share blame for the death camps?

If so, SHUT THE F*** UP AND GET YOUR FACTS RIGHT, please, before you type another letter or utter another sound. Hitler HATED Slavs, especially Poles, almost as much as he hated Jews, and he persecuted them, too. That is historical FACT, that every elderly Pole would probably well know. There were many, many, many non-Jewish Poles put to death in the camps there, almost as many as there were Jews. That's a FACT, which you can confirm in now-public records, at least if you can read German and Polish. It used to be public knowledge in the aftermath of the war, but it seems largely forgotten today, probably because Poles have very little media voice and would rather not keep alive memories of occupation, whereas most media is owned by Jewish people, who aggressively keep their victimization alive in the public memory. It seems that time and an imbalanced situation is causing a total re-write of people's memory of historical facts.

The idea that Poles were somehow responsible for the death camps (which were SLAV AND JEWISH (BOTH!) killing machines!) is an outrageous, unconscionable distortion of history. If that is what is being implied here, then Poles SHOULD be outraged, livid at the accusations. I know I am.

But then again, Obama has stuck his foot in his mouth about overseas/foreign stuff about as often as Bush did, so it is no surprise (Cinco de Mayo, anyone?) if he has done it again. I'm just surprised it got reported on!

JJIII
06-04-2012, 01:15 PM
Arkay is here with guns blazing!:D

Welcome, Arkay.

Zeke
06-04-2012, 03:13 PM
The idea that Poles were somehow responsible for the death camps (which were SLAV AND JEWISH (BOTH!) killing machines!) is an outrageous, unconscionable distortion of history.

And the idea that they were 100% innocent is actually worse: it implies a lack of social conscience as well as unwillingness to address reality.

As I said, Indians rode with Custer.

It is what it is

piece-itpete
06-04-2012, 03:27 PM
I'm sure Obama wanted to discuss the Polish turncoats and honor them for their service.

Pete

BlueStreak
06-04-2012, 04:45 PM
There is such rampant distortion in the re-writing of history sometimes, it makes me sick.

You're saying that there were a few Polish people complicit in Nazi enforcement of death camps, and somehow Poles should be thrown in with Nazis in the persecution of Jews, and share blame for the death camps?

If so, SHUT THE F*** UP AND GET YOUR FACTS RIGHT, please, before you type another letter or utter another sound. Hitler HATED Slavs, especially Poles, almost as much as he hated Jews, and he persecuted them, too. That is historical FACT, that every elderly Pole would probably well know. There were many, many, many non-Jewish Poles put to death in the camps there, almost as many as there were Jews. That's a FACT, which you can confirm in now-public records, at least if you can read German and Polish. It used to be public knowledge in the aftermath of the war, but it seems largely forgotten today, probably because Poles have very little media voice and would rather not keep alive memories of occupation, whereas most media is owned by Jewish people, who aggressively keep their victimization alive in the public memory. It seems that time and an imbalanced situation is causing a total re-write of people's memory of historical facts.

The idea that Poles were somehow responsible for the death camps (which were SLAV AND JEWISH (BOTH!) killing machines!) is an outrageous, unconscionable distortion of history. If that is what is being implied here, then Poles SHOULD be outraged, livid at the accusations. I know I am.

But then again, Obama has stuck his foot in his mouth about overseas/foreign stuff about as often as Bush did, so it is no surprise (Cinco de Mayo, anyone?) if he has done it again. I'm just surprised it got reported on!

And the idea that they were 100% innocent is actually worse: it implies a lack of social conscience as well as unwillingness to address reality.

As I said, Indians rode with Custer.

It is what it is

Thanks, again, Zeke.

And Arkay;

No, that's not what I'm saying. Absolutes are rarely correct, my friend. The real world just doesn't work that way.

Dave

Zeke
06-04-2012, 05:00 PM
I'm sure Obama wanted to discuss the Polish turncoats and honor them for their service.

Pete

Which is the bottom line to the whole thing: we all know darned good and well that no insult was intended. This is merely a case of hypersensitivity caused by, at worst, a failure in wordsmithing.

Addressing it makes it worse.

[Obi-Wan voice with hand wave] "You don't need to know the author's identification. This is not the foreign relations gaffe you're looking for. Obama can go about his business. Move along."

bobabode
06-04-2012, 05:41 PM
Arkay is here with guns blazing!:D

Welcome, Arkay.

Yup and about time. Welcome Arkay! The IQ level has experienced a significant bump up the scale. Unfortunately there are plenty of idjits around to still keeps us's in double digits.:(

piece-itpete
06-05-2012, 08:32 AM
I agree Zeke. Both sides going to extremes I'd say. Politics is.... fun? :rolleyes: :D

Pete

djv8ga
06-07-2012, 09:10 PM
Which is the bottom line to the whole thing: we all know darned good and well that no insult was intended. This is merely a case of hypersensitivity caused by, at worst, a failure in wordsmithing.

Addressing it makes it worse.

[Obi-Wan voice with hand wave] "You don't need to know the author's identification. This is not the foreign relations gaffe you're looking for. Obama can go about his business. Move along."
Meathead.

bobabode
06-07-2012, 09:28 PM
Meathead.

Somehow your new avatar dilutes that sentiment or did you just find out that Carrol O'Conner is a flaming liberal.....:rolleyes:

Boreas
06-07-2012, 09:43 PM
Somehow your new avatar dilutes that sentiment or did you just find out that Carrol O'Conner is a flaming liberal.....:rolleyes:

You mean you don't think choosing a murderous racist nativist bigot for his avatar was an appropriate choice?

John

bobabode
06-08-2012, 12:02 AM
You mean you don't think choosing a murderous racist nativist bigot for his avatar was an appropriate choice?

John

Deej used to have good ol Archie Bunker as an avatar. The gangs of New York "Know Nothing Party" poster child is way more appropo, Hehehe;)

BlueStreak
06-08-2012, 02:17 AM
You mean you don't think choosing a murderous racist nativist bigot for his avatar was an appropriate choice?

John

I thought it was a perfect fit.

Boreas
06-08-2012, 10:55 AM
I thought it was a perfect fit.

Yeah,me too.

John

Zeke
06-08-2012, 12:42 PM
Meathead.

I love it when you go ad hominem.

It just means you got your ass kicked. :D