Obama to take sweeping action on climate

[bobabode]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/obama-to-take-sweeping-action-on-climate/2013/06/22/d28de366-db77-11e2-a9f2-42ee3912ae0e_story.html

:)

[Charles]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/obama-to-take-sweeping-action-on-climate/2013/06/22/d28de366-db77-11e2-a9f2-42ee3912ae0e_story.html

:)

“The president confronts many threats that appear more urgent, but none are more important to his legacy,” Lashof said.

Chas

[whell]

“The president confronts many threats that appear more urgent, but none are more important to his legacy,” Lashof said.

Chas

We're still not creating jobs at a rate sufficient to get more Americans back to work, and there is a negative correlation between environmental regulation and economic growth. But such details have never stood in this administration's way of pursuing their agenda.

[Dondilion]

We're still not creating jobs at a rate sufficient to get more Americans back to work, and there is a negative correlation between environmental regulation and economic growth. But such details have never stood in this administration's way of pursuing their agenda.

We have been doing much better than the rest of the western world in jobs creation.

Environmental issues cannot be placed on the back burner for too long.

Dispite all the propaganda of the greed is good community people are more knowledgeable re the environs.

Check Turkey: The government wanted to take away the little green space in the city to give it to business. Yes, and to provide jobs. :D

[finnbow]

I'll bet this is just part of a broader administration package that includes opening up the Keystone pipeline. He'll thereby throw a bone to Labor (in favor of the pipeline) and environmentalists (in favor of Green energy).

[bobabode]

We're still not creating jobs at a rate sufficient to get more Americans back to work, and there is a negative correlation between environmental regulation and economic growth. But such details have never stood in this administration's way of pursuing their agenda.

It's just the pendelum swinging. After eight years of drill baby drill and deregulation of everything, we are seeing smarter heads prevail finally.

[whell]

We have been doing much better than the rest of the western world in jobs creation.



Um, not so much.

http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2013/06/rich-countries-are-creating-more-jobs-by-creating-worse-jobs/276505/

[Zeke]

...such details have never stood in this administration's way of pursuing their agenda.

Like fixing the country? :rolleyes:

[Dondilion]

Um, not so much.

http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2013/06/rich-countries-are-creating-more-jobs-by-creating-worse-jobs/276505/

If your country is poor or very poor, then it is hard to create worse jobs.

[whell]

Like fixing the country? :rolleyes:

Yeah. He'll fix it, but good! :rolleyes:

[bobabode]

Um, not so much.

http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2013/06/rich-countries-are-creating-more-jobs-by-creating-worse-jobs/276505/

You're referencing the U.N.I.L.O. study! We'll make a community organizer out of you yet, Mike..,;):)

[piece-itpete]

Great! I was hoping my electric bill would go up ;)

Pete

[bobabode]

Great! I was hoping my electric bill would go up ;)

Pete

West Virginny is doing so well with mountain top removal, which fills in the hollers and silts up the streams. At least they're getting brand new golf courses as a result of Massey's reclamation efforts.:rolleyes:

[Zeke]

Yeah. He'll fix it, but good! :rolleyes:

It's already markedly improved. :D

[bobabode]

It's already markedly improved. :D

Yup! Real estate values are climbing out of the toilet after taking a nosedive and anyone with a 401k is happier. The American auto biz is back.

Sure is funny how some like to believe that Obama is some wild eyed lefty soshalist bent on destroying capitalism when the opposite is true. Must be all that Glenn Beck, Breibart and Faux News that they are watching?:rolleyes:

[BlueStreak]

We're still not creating jobs at a rate sufficient to get more Americans back to work, and there is a negative correlation between environmental regulation and economic growth. But such details have never stood in this administration's way of pursuing their agenda.

Maybe so, but, we've all seen the effects of unchecked industrial pollution on public health and environment. (Especially those of us who grew up in the Rust Belt during the so-called "Good ol' days".) I am just old enough to recall the days when residents in Youngstown and Pittsburgh would be advised to stay indoors during "inversions".

For those who don't know, an "inversion" is when certain weather conditions move over a valley and prevent pollutants from escaping. It would get so thick you could see it hanging in the air and get a metallic taste in your mouth. Google up "Donora, Pennsylvania Smog" to see just how bad it was before environmental regulation. Or, better yet, Google up "China industrial pollution" to see how bad it IS.

Do you really think that was good?

It truly is a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation, isn't it, Mike?

Dave

[whell]

It truly is a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation, isn't it, Mike?

Dave

Not necessarily. Timing, and approach, are everything. The government can take unilateral action, or it can be a partner. And there's nothing more compelling right now than getting the economy growing again and getting folks back to work. The environmentalists can wait until the economic picture improves. Then they'll really have something to bitch about. ;)

[BlueStreak]

Not necessarily. Timing, and approach, are everything. The government can take unilateral action, or it can be a partner. And there's nothing more compelling right now than getting the economy growing again and getting folks back to work. The environmentalists can wait until the economic picture improves. Then they'll really have something to bitch about. ;)

I don't want them to have anything to bitch about. What you said about the government can also be said of industry.

And, in regards to this;

"And there's nothing more compelling right now than getting the economy growing again and getting folks back to work."

I couldn't agree more. Except, I happen to believe that which is built too quickly, falls apart just as quickly. And, that if it is built on a foundation too far tilted towards exploitation of resources, which includes human resources, that that foundation is only built upon the seeds of it's own destruction.

Dave

[bobabode]

I don't want them to have anything to bitch about. What you said about the government can also be said of industry.

And, in regards to this;

"And there's nothing more compelling right now than getting the economy growing again and getting folks back to work."

I couldn't agree more. Except, I happen to believe that which is built too quickly, falls apart just as quickly. And, that if it is built on a foundation too far tilted towards exploitation of resources, which includes human resources, that that foundation is only built upon the seeds of it's own destruction.

Dave

Wise words, Dave.

[barbara]

Geezzz... The economy is doing better than it has in a long time, unemployment figures are improving, and I see people who haven't had jobs in years going to work....

Admittedly, the turn around is taking time, as it should...

And still, people complain?
Couldn't just be a case of partisan sour grapes, eh?
,

[BlueStreak]

Geezzz... The economy is doing better than it has in a long time, unemployment figures are improving, and I see people who haven't had jobs in years going to work....

Admittedly, the turn around is taking time, as it should...

And still, people complain?
Couldn't just be a case of partisan sour grapes, eh?
,

Really, Barb? Republicans angry because they lost? Naw! Not them..................:rolleyes:

Dave

[barbara]

Really, Barb? Republicans angry because they lost? Naw! Not them..................:rolleyes:

Dave

............:)

[piece-itpete]

It is a hesitant recovery at best.

Dave I lived at the very edge of the industrial flats in Cleveland in the early 80s, if the wind was blowing the wrong way when it rained everything would get covered in a thin black muck.

Pete

[BlueStreak]

Dave I lived at the very edge of the industrial flats in Cleveland in the early 80s, if the wind was blowing the wrong way when it rained everything would get covered in a thin black muck.

Pete

Yes, that did still happen in the early '80s. Not so much on the tail end of the '80s though and I'm sure it was totally gone by 2009.

Domestically produced steel is so expensive...............:rolleyes:

Dave

[piece-itpete]

Sadly, I was working at a steel warehouse in the 80s, when domestic steel came in we had to mic every coil for tolerance, when jap steel came in we mic'd 1 coil to make sure they didn't mis-ship - they were always in tolerance. Still irritates me.

The big difference I see in production here is, back then at night the flats would be alight with 100s' of small smokestack flames, now there's only one large one. Heck once I was driving through Republic/LTV at night and all the railroad tracks were on fire, it was very cool. I have no idea why though.

Good times. In winter we used to hike down into the valley, there was a spot where very large ingots of redhot raw steel came out of one building on tracks and slowly moved into another. Heat! Great place to party :) The workers never got mad at us, although once we were wandering around deep in the heart of the plant (it must be square miles) (with beer) and they threw us out.

Pete

[merrylander]

The steel mill owners were in the catbird seat after WW II as the Japanes and Eiuropean mills had been flattened. The mill owners made large profits but instead of investing in newer equipment the pissed away the profits.

Having to totally re-build the Japanese and Europeans invested in the latest technology so the U.S. mills were no longer competitive.

[piece-itpete]

The greatest generation screwed up? :)

Every time I see this thread title I picture the Pres with a giant broom.

Pete

[BlueStreak]

The steel mill owners were in the catbird seat after WW II as the Japanes and Eiuropean mills had been flattened. The mill owners made large profits but instead of investing in newer equipment the pissed away the profits.

Having to totally re-build the Japanese and Europeans invested in the latest technology so the U.S. mills were no longer competitive.

Ayup. I remember a mill in Youngstown investing a few million in furnace upgrades only to shut down the following year. Too little, too late.

Another fascinating story is one of Bethlehem Steel executives building golf courses at nearly every facility as they went into bankruptcy for the final time in the 1990s. They simply assumed that they were still so vital to the economy and national defense that the government would bail them out, no questions asked. Their thinking really was that far behind the times as BethSteel had ceased to be vital in either way decades earlier. Amazing.

Dave

[Charles]

I see that Obama has taken the tactic of ridicule, straight from "Rules for Radicals", to label any critics of his push for more EPA controls as members of the " Flat Earth Society".

http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/307655-obama-we-dont-have-time-for-a-meeting-of-the-flat-earth-society#ixzz2XFsQ5mgH

Which is the sort of diatribe I would expect from the leading cheerleader of the "Chicken Little Society".

Apparently, he has given even less thought as to what these actions will do concerning the economic recovery as he extended whenever he discussed the "profits/earning" ratio concerning the stock market.

I DO wish he would stick to doing something he's proficient at...such as being a freeloading golfer at the taxpayer's expense.

Chas

[Charles]

The steel mill owners were in the catbird seat after WW II as the Japanes and Eiuropean mills had been flattened. The mill owners made large profits but instead of investing in newer equipment the pissed away the profits.

Having to totally re-build the Japanese and Europeans invested in the latest technology so the U.S. mills were no longer competitive.

The truth be known, I tend to suspect that the mill owners invested PLENTY in foreign markets.

After all, that's what giant multinationals do, They've been doing it forever, and they're doing it to this day.

Chas

[Charles]

Ayup. I remember a mill in Youngstown investing a few million in furnace upgrades only to shut down the following year. Too little, too late.

Another fascinating story is one of Bethlehem Steel executives building golf courses at nearly every facility as they went into bankruptcy for the final time in the 1990s. They simply assumed that they were still so vital to the economy and national defense that the government would bail them out, no questions asked. Their thinking really was that far behind the times as BethSteel had ceased to be vital in either way decades earlier. Amazing.

Dave

A feller can make pretty good money going broke...if he knows what he's doing.

Chas

[barbara]

I see that Obama has taken the tactic of ridicule, straight from "Rules for Radicals", to label any critics of his push for more EPA controls as members of the " Flat Earth Society".

http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/307655-obama-we-dont-have-time-for-a-meeting-of-the-flat-earth-society#ixzz2XFsQ5mgH

Which is the sort of diatribe I would expect from the leading cheerleader of the "Chicken Little Society".

Apparently, he has given even less thought as to what these actions will do concerning the economic recovery as he extended whenever he discussed the "profits/earning" ratio concerning the stock market.

I DO wish he would stick to doing something he's proficient at...such as being a freeloading golfer at the taxpayer's expense.

Chas

Seems to me that tactic was well used during the Bush administration when anyone who questioned the truth behind WNDs was labeled 'unAmerican' and 'unpatriotic'.

Guess the Bush and his cohorts must be very familiar with those Rules for Radicals you referenced.

[finnbow]

Seems to me that tactic was well used during the Bush administration when anyone who questioned the truth behind WNDs was labeled 'unAmerican' and 'unpatriotic'.

Guess the Bush and his cohorts must be very familiar with those Rules for Radicals you referenced.

Indeed. There's no successful tactic employed only by one side of the political aisle. If it works, they all do it and creating/exploiting fear is very high in the hierarchy of political tactics, perhaps at the very top.

[Charles]

Seems to me that tactic was well used during the Bush administration when anyone who questioned the truth behind WNDs was labeled 'unAmerican' and 'unpatriotic'.

Guess the Bush and his cohorts must be very familiar with those Rules for Radicals you referenced.

He started it, Mommy!!!

Chas

[finnbow]

He started it, Mommy!!!

Chas

Neither of them started it. They're simply engaging in a tactic as old as American politics.

[BlueStreak]

The greatest generation screwed up? :)

Every time I see this thread title I picture the Pres with a giant broom.

Pete

Um....Actually, in some ways...Yes. And, I think you know that, Pete.

But, then, considering the way they suffered in the years preceding and during the war, I really can't blame them for taking advantage of the unique situation and the times they lived in following WW2. I would have done the same.

Dave

[BlueStreak]

Neither of them started it. They're simply engaging in a tactic as old as American politics.

Ayup.

Dave

[barbara]

He started it, Mommy!!!

Chas

Just pointing out the obvious, Chas.

If you don't want to see a comparison to a republican, don't try pinning wrong doing on one party when both are equally guilty.

[BlueStreak]

Seems to me that tactic was well used during the Bush administration when anyone who questioned the truth behind WNDs was labeled 'unAmerican' and 'unpatriotic'.

Guess the Bush and his cohorts must be very familiar with those Rules for Radicals you referenced.

Indeed. There's no successful tactic employed only by one side of the political aisle. If it works, they all do it and creating/exploiting fear is very high in the hierarchy of political tactics, perhaps at the very top.

Actually the Republican mastery of this technique is awe inspiring.

I don't recall who said it, but I recently saw a quote that went something like;

"The most tragic aspect of modern Liberalism is that it will be most staunchly opposed by those who stand to gain the most from it."

Of course you will oppose something such as Medicare when you have been conditioned to believe that receiving anything from the government makes you a mooching welfare case..............:rolleyes:

Dave

[merrylander]

The greatest generation screwed up? :)

Every time I see this thread title I picture the Pres with a giant broom.

Pete

I said the mill owners Pete, I doubt that any of them saw service.

[merrylander]

I saw McConnell weeping and bleating about some imagined war on coal. Years (and I mean years) ago I worked for Combustion Engineering, a big boilermaker. We made furnaces that ran on coal so we put scrubbers in the smoke stacks, or just ahead of the smoke stacks. This cleaned the stuff going up the stack and also recovered a saleable substance from the smoke.

Truth be known it is the cheap natural gas from fracking that is killing coal. Who knows this might eventually leave some mountains in West Virginia.

[Charles]

Just pointing out the obvious, Chas.

If you don't want to see a comparison to a republican, don't try pinning wrong doing on one party when both are equally guilty.

But all the other kids get to do it all of the time.

Especially the Chicken Little's!!!

Chas

[Charles]

While Obama is busy trying to force Mr. Peabody to give up his coal hauling ways, it's interesting to note that he's also offering him (incentives and the use of public lands) the ability to REALLY bugger everyone with solar and wind.

And the big wheel keeps a'turning.

Chas

[piece-itpete]

I find it ironic that when the legit arguments against spending billions or trillions on global warming stuff are put forward there is no answer from the wise and intelligent left.

Pete

[Dondilion]

Obama is brave!

So many politicians ran from the coal issue.

[merrylander]

I find it ironic that when the legit arguments against spending billions or trillions on global warming stuff are put forward there is no answer from the wise and intelligent left.

Pete

Why, would you rather piss it away on the MIC or BIC.

[icenine]

Why, would you rather piss it away on the MIC or BIC.

hey at least I coined the term BIC lol:D

[piece-itpete]

It'll be in addition to, not instead of.

And of course driving up the cost of basic goods and services will effect the poor the most.

Pete

[icenine]

I find it ironic that when the legit arguments against spending billions or trillions on global warming stuff are put forward there is no answer from the wise and intelligent left.

Pete

Miami will be under water by the end of the century.

[piece-itpete]

How will any or even all of the measures desired effect that in the slightest?

Keep in mind the theory is we are already effecting the climate. In order to stop the change already in process we need to significantly lower the amount of (choose: CO2, CH4, or both) (or something else) we are pumping into the atmosphere and right quick, and that might be too little too late. Lowering the rate it's increasing by will not work. The cat is out of the bag.

It may be a good idea regardless, but will not stop Miami from being flooded.

So perhaps we should spend the money preparing instead?

Pete

[bobabode]

It'll be in addition to, not instead of.

And of course driving up the cost of basic goods and services will effect the poor the most.

Pete

Especially if your party suceeds in gutting the Food Stamp program.

[piece-itpete]

Darn, I thought Clinton already took care of that ;)

Pete

[Charles]

I find it ironic that when the legit arguments against spending billions or trillions on global warming stuff are put forward there is no answer from the wise and intelligent left.

Pete

Sure there is.

"The sky's falling!!!"

Chas

[icenine]

How will any or even all of the measures desired effect that in the slightest?

Keep in mind the theory is we are already effecting the climate. In order to stop the change already in process we need to significantly lower the amount of (choose: CO2, CH4, or both) (or something else) we are pumping into the atmosphere and right quick, and that might be too little too late. Lowering the rate it's increasing by will not work. The cat is out of the bag.

It may be a good idea regardless, but will not stop Miami from being flooded.

So perhaps we should spend the money preparing instead?

Pete

perhaps the ability to replace a selenium rectifier in an old Fisher 400C may help you survive in a post apocalyptic climate changed USA...on the other hand you will be 150 years old lol

[Charles]

perhaps the ability to replace a selenium rectifier in an old Fisher 400C may help you survive in a post apocalyptic climate changed USA...on the other hand you will be 150 years old lol

I can't help but wonder how much a solar/wind based electrical system would cost that had the ability to reliably push JUST a 400C.

I'm pretty happy shelling out $.11 per KW, and would just as soon see our resources directed at keeping it like that.

I also figure that we can stay close to that rate and "save the planet" by simply refining the sources we currently have, and then adopt more modern forms of technology whenever they become more economically feasible.

But I'm a tight fisted hillbilly, and the only way you're going to sell me the "better mousetrap" is to actually make a better one.

And forcing me into the poorhouse via governmental/crony capitalism fiat ain't what I call a better mousetrap.

Don't know what folks call that everywhere else, but down here in Missouri we call that a fuckin'.

Chas

[JJIII]

Don't know what folks call that everywhere else, but down here in Missouri we call that a fuckin'.

Chas

Bam!:)

[bobabode]

Bam!:)

Jeez, JJ. Charlie drop his soap again?:rolleyes:

[JJIII]

Check this out...



"Congressman Griffith's Weekly E-Newsletter 6.24.13

Friday, June 24, 2013 –




The War on Coal Continues, but Maybe There Is a Light at the End of the Tunnel


As the war on coal drags on, the President is proposing even more regulations that will negatively impact the coal industry, its jobs, and the economy of Southwest Virginia. Rest assured that I will do everything that I can to stop unreasonable regulations.


Now we all want affordable energy that is clean and efficient. If we can convince this Administration to no longer look at coal as a four-letter word, they can get what they want and we can get what we want. That is, clean-burning coal that doesn’t negatively impact the environment and that, in the process, doesn’t destroy the economy of Southwest Virginia.


Those who fight on the side of coal may have a new weapon. We now have research from Dr. Liang-Shih Fan at The Ohio State University (OSU) that I hope will turn the tide of history in favor of clean, affordable energy, including coal.


Dr. Fan is a professor of chemical and biomolecular engineering at OSU, where he is also the director of the university’s Clean Coal Research Laboratory. Over the last 15 years, Dr. Fan and a team of researchers have been developing a new clean-coal technology that extracts the energy out of coal with virtually no pollutants.


In this method – known as “coal-direct chemical looping (CDCL)” or simply “chemical looping” – the coal is ground into a fine powder. Also needed in the chemical reaction are small iron oxide beads, which carry oxygen.


When the coal particles and the metal beads are heated to temperatures of about 1,650 °F, the coal’s carbon binds with the beads’ oxygen and forms pure carbon dioxide. The carbon dioxide floats up and is captured, able to be recycled or stored.


This leaves behind hot iron beads and coal ash. The beads are separated from the coal ash – the coal ash is removed, and the beads are sent to a different area where they react with air and produce heat energy. This heat energy boils water and produces steam which, in turn, is used to produce electricity.


Exposed to oxygen, the iron beads rust, and are eventually returned to the first area to be combined again with new coal particles. This is where the “looping” in “chemical looping” comes into play.


For nine days – 203 continuous hours – Dr. Fan and students at OSU ran this chemical looping process, producing heat from coal while also capturing nearly 100% of the carbon dioxide produced.


According to a press release from OSU, “doctoral student Elena Chung explained, the 203-hour experiment could have continued even longer.


“‘We voluntarily chose to stop the unit. Honestly, it was a mutual decision by Dr. Fan and the students. It was a long and tiring week where we all shared shifts,’ she says.”


Amazing. So what happens next with this exciting advancement in clean-coal technologies?


I had the opportunity to speak with Dr. Fan recently, and expressed my support and enthusiasm for his work. I am grateful to The Ohio State University for embracing Dr. Fan’s research efforts, and to the Department of Energy (DOE), the National Energy Technology Laboratory, and Dr. Fan’s industrial collaborators – Babcock & Wilcox, ClearSkies, CONSOL Energy, Air Products, and Shell-CRI - for recognizing the potential and investing their resources in Dr. Fan’s research.


A pilot plant is being built in Wilsonville, Alabama at the National Carbon Capture Center that will test a similar chemical looping process also developed by Dr. Fan and his team. In this process the coal is converted to a combination of carbon monoxide, methane, and other gases – a mixture known as ‘syngas’ – which then reacts with iron to produce energy and capture carbon dioxide.


These technologies look very promising. What we end up with is pure carbon dioxide only, which we must then deal with. According to my conversation with Dr. Fan, his technology makes the ‘carbon capture process’ 60 percent cheaper.


Many of you already know that my vision for our nation’s energy policy is straightforward – drill, dig, discover, and deregulate. We must use the sources we have to unleash our energy potential. Coal, natural gas, oil, wind, solar – whatever the source may be, if it’s economical, let’s discover a way to harvest it. Dr. Fan’s clean-coal technologies appear to be one of the discoveries with great promise.


These are exciting developments in clean-coal technology that I look forward to monitoring. Rest assured that I will keep you informed, and will continue working to secure our energy future and, in turn, return jobs to the Ninth District.

As always, if you have questions, concerns, or comments, feel free to call my Abingdon office at 276-525-1405 or my Christiansburg office at 540-381-5671. To reach my office by email, please visit my website at www.morgangriffith.house.gov."

[Charles]

Check this out...



"Congressman Griffith's Weekly E-Newsletter 6.24.13

Friday, June 24, 2013 –




The War on Coal Continues, but Maybe There Is a Light at the End of the Tunnel


As the war on coal drags on, the President is proposing even more regulations that will negatively impact the coal industry, its jobs, and the economy of Southwest Virginia. Rest assured that I will do everything that I can to stop unreasonable regulations.


Now we all want affordable energy that is clean and efficient. If we can convince this Administration to no longer look at coal as a four-letter word, they can get what they want and we can get what we want. That is, clean-burning coal that doesn’t negatively impact the environment and that, in the process, doesn’t destroy the economy of Southwest Virginia.


Those who fight on the side of coal may have a new weapon. We now have research from Dr. Liang-Shih Fan at The Ohio State University (OSU) that I hope will turn the tide of history in favor of clean, affordable energy, including coal.


Dr. Fan is a professor of chemical and biomolecular engineering at OSU, where he is also the director of the university’s Clean Coal Research Laboratory. Over the last 15 years, Dr. Fan and a team of researchers have been developing a new clean-coal technology that extracts the energy out of coal with virtually no pollutants.


In this method – known as “coal-direct chemical looping (CDCL)” or simply “chemical looping” – the coal is ground into a fine powder. Also needed in the chemical reaction are small iron oxide beads, which carry oxygen.


When the coal particles and the metal beads are heated to temperatures of about 1,650 °F, the coal’s carbon binds with the beads’ oxygen and forms pure carbon dioxide. The carbon dioxide floats up and is captured, able to be recycled or stored.


This leaves behind hot iron beads and coal ash. The beads are separated from the coal ash – the coal ash is removed, and the beads are sent to a different area where they react with air and produce heat energy. This heat energy boils water and produces steam which, in turn, is used to produce electricity.


Exposed to oxygen, the iron beads rust, and are eventually returned to the first area to be combined again with new coal particles. This is where the “looping” in “chemical looping” comes into play.


For nine days – 203 continuous hours – Dr. Fan and students at OSU ran this chemical looping process, producing heat from coal while also capturing nearly 100% of the carbon dioxide produced.


According to a press release from OSU, “doctoral student Elena Chung explained, the 203-hour experiment could have continued even longer.


“‘We voluntarily chose to stop the unit. Honestly, it was a mutual decision by Dr. Fan and the students. It was a long and tiring week where we all shared shifts,’ she says.”


Amazing. So what happens next with this exciting advancement in clean-coal technologies?


I had the opportunity to speak with Dr. Fan recently, and expressed my support and enthusiasm for his work. I am grateful to The Ohio State University for embracing Dr. Fan’s research efforts, and to the Department of Energy (DOE), the National Energy Technology Laboratory, and Dr. Fan’s industrial collaborators – Babcock & Wilcox, ClearSkies, CONSOL Energy, Air Products, and Shell-CRI - for recognizing the potential and investing their resources in Dr. Fan’s research.


A pilot plant is being built in Wilsonville, Alabama at the National Carbon Capture Center that will test a similar chemical looping process also developed by Dr. Fan and his team. In this process the coal is converted to a combination of carbon monoxide, methane, and other gases – a mixture known as ‘syngas’ – which then reacts with iron to produce energy and capture carbon dioxide.


These technologies look very promising. What we end up with is pure carbon dioxide only, which we must then deal with. According to my conversation with Dr. Fan, his technology makes the ‘carbon capture process’ 60 percent cheaper.


Many of you already know that my vision for our nation’s energy policy is straightforward – drill, dig, discover, and deregulate. We must use the sources we have to unleash our energy potential. Coal, natural gas, oil, wind, solar – whatever the source may be, if it’s economical, let’s discover a way to harvest it. Dr. Fan’s clean-coal technologies appear to be one of the discoveries with great promise.


These are exciting developments in clean-coal technology that I look forward to monitoring. Rest assured that I will keep you informed, and will continue working to secure our energy future and, in turn, return jobs to the Ninth District.

As always, if you have questions, concerns, or comments, feel free to call my Abingdon office at 276-525-1405 or my Christiansburg office at 540-381-5671. To reach my office by email, please visit my website at www.morgangriffith.house.gov."

It's amazing that all of those highly educated people still think that the Earth is flat.

Chas

[Charles]

Jeez, JJ. Charlie drop his soap again?:rolleyes:

What's soap???

Chas

[BlueStreak]

I wonder if "Clean Coal" research is subsidized with federal money?

[BlueStreak]

http://www.upi.com/Business_News/Energy-Resources/2012/06/07/US-funding-clean-coal-research/UPI-28161339070250/

http://serc.osu.edu/state-development-office-offers-funding-clean-coal-research-and-development

Both state and federal funding.

Dave

[BlueStreak]

"Obamas War on (Clean) Coal"? What war on coal? Dirty coal, maybe, but who gives a shit about that? Good riddence to it.

http://content.usatoday.com/communities/greenhouse/post/2010/03/clean-coal-energy-department-spends-154-million-on-texas-project-to-capture-coals-carbon/1#.Ucwi4KxWqBk

Dave

[BlueStreak]

Was the cessation of vacuum tube production, "Reagans War on Tubes"?

You guys fall for the silliest shit, I swear.

Dave

[Charles]

http://www.upi.com/Business_News/Energy-Resources/2012/06/07/US-funding-clean-coal-research/UPI-28161339070250/

http://serc.osu.edu/state-development-office-offers-funding-clean-coal-research-and-development

Both state and federal funding.

Dave

Looks like we're getting a lot of bang for our buck funding CCR&D.

Chas

[Charles]

Was the cessation of vacuum tube production, "Reagans War on Tubes"?

You guys fall for the silliest shit, I swear.

Dave

Well of course we do, we're the "Flat Earthers"...remember???

Chas

[BlueStreak]

Well of course we do, we're the "Flat Earthers"...remember???

Chas

Well, the left does have their "War on Women" which is just as silly. Not that I don't support some of those issues. It's the "War on ___" thing that is cliche'd to death and drives me nuts. Regardless of who's doing it.

Dave

[BlueStreak]

Why would the president push for funding for "Clean Coal" then wage a "War on Coal"?

Maybe somebody just doesn't want to be put through the inconvenience and expense of pursuing and ultimately implementing the new technology? It's cheaper and easier to just keep pumping garbage into the atmosphere? NAW! They wouldn't do that! After all, they breathe too....right? Well, I guess when your plants are busy belching filth into the sky in Ohio, Oregon and Alabama, but your hanging out in your personal ski chalet in the Swiss Alps enjoying the fresh mountain air, it doesn't bother you so much?

Dave

[JJIII]

It's amazing that all of those highly educated people still think that the Earth is flat.

Chas

No, we don't think it's flat... we're trying to make it flat!;)

[piece-itpete]

It's amazing that all of those highly educated people still think that the Earth is flat.

Chas

BAM!

Pete

[Charles]

No, we don't think it's flat... we're trying to make it flat!;)

We're gonna have us a dandy turnip patch!!!

Chas

[JJIII]

We're gonna have us a dandy turnip patch!!!

Chas

Lets have us a party!! :D

"The joy of the ‘Joy of Cooking,’ circa 1962
By Bonnie Azab Powell @ 1:56 pm on 14 October 2006.

This posted is rated NV: Not for Vegetarians.

Possum recipeA friend in the book-publishing industry was dining at our house last week and rhapsodizing about old Joy of Cooking editions, particularly the illustrations from the '60s. Lo and behold, on my shelf was a 1962 edition my father had given me.

The book opens with an epigram from Goethe's Faust: "That which thy fathers have bequeathed to thee, earn it anew if thou wouldst possess it."

I was willing to try, but wow, culinary traditions have changed.

Alan went straight for the opossum recipe. If possible, the home chef is to trap this nocturnal animal and feed it on milk and cereal for 10 days before attempting to parboil, roast, and eat it, perhaps with some turnip greens. Okaaaaaay!"

[bobabode]

Does it taste like chicken, JJ?:rolleyes: Sure looks like a rat to me...;)

We've got them all over the place here in California...

[CarlV]

Especially if your party suceeds in gutting the Food Stamp program.

That's the beauty of that act of contempt for the financially boderline working class family, you just do a Romney, breakup the bill and declare bankruptcy on the Food Stamp part by just not funding it at all. Not quite a sequester but it is fun making sure kids go to school with missed-meal cramps and can't really concentrate. The elderly and less fortunate as well. :rolleyes:


Carl

[JJIII]

Does it taste like chicken, JJ?:rolleyes: Sure looks like a rat to me...;)

We've got them all over the place here in California...

Never tried to eat one. Even the vultures around here leave them alone!:eek:

[BlueStreak]

That's the beauty of that act of contempt for the financially boderline working class family, you just do a Romney, breakup the bill and declare bankruptcy on the Food Stamp part by just not funding it at all. Not quite a sequester but it is fun making sure kids go to school with missed-meal cramps and can't really concentrate. The elderly and less fortunate as well. :rolleyes:


Carl

I guess that where the "Christian Family Values" really shine through?

Dave

[merrylander]

We're gonna have us a dandy turnip patch!!!

Chas

Except that the soil left behind is so toxic you can't grow shit in it.

[Charles]

Except that the soil left behind is so toxic you can't grow shit in it.

Well, I suppose we could always use the real estate as a dump for toxic wastes created during the manufacturing process of solar panels.

http://www.motherjones.com/blue-marble/2010/03/are-your-solar-panels-toxic

You've plugged for a certain variety of nuke plants which are somewhat different than what is currently the industry standard. Can't remember the difference at the moment, but I'm sure you can.

They sounded very reasonable. Any thoughts as to why they aren't on the public radar?

Chas

[Charles]

Never tried to eat one. Even the vultures around here leave them alone!:eek:

If you're going to sell someone a carcass, be sure and leave one foot intact...otherwise you'll be suspected of selling cats.

At least that was the way my buddy sold 'em around 45 yrs ago.

Myself, they just don't have the appeal of a highly marbled ribeye.

Chas

[bobabode]

If you're going to sell someone a carcass, be sure and leave one foot intact...otherwise you'll be suspected of selling cats.

At least that was the way my buddy sold 'em around 45 yrs ago.

Myself, they just don't have the appeal of a highly marbled ribeye.

Chas

I thought y'all stewed the heads? Mebbe I'm thinking of goats....:rolleyes:
Give me a Porterhouse anyday.:)

[merrylander]

Well, I suppose we could always use the real estate as a dump for toxic wastes created during the manufacturing process of solar panels.

http://www.motherjones.com/blue-marble/2010/03/are-your-solar-panels-toxic

You've plugged for a certain variety of nuke plants which are somewhat different than what is currently the industry standard. Can't remember the difference at the moment, but I'm sure you can.

They sounded very reasonable. Any thoughts as to why they aren't on the public radar?

Chas

The CANDU heavy water reactor used in Canada, guess it is the usual not invented here deal. They sold them to India and they are planning to run them on Thorium. They regularly use un-enriched Uranium and could even burn the waste fuel from high pressure designs. Oh yes, in the event of a power failure all the control rods drop so it shuts down.

[merrylander]

Never tried to eat one. Even the vultures around here leave them alone!:eek:

Well the Good Lord was not kind when He deigned the poor possum but I will say this for them. They occasionally stop by to see if our feral cats have left any food as do the racoons. The possums are quiet, neat and don't leave a mess. Not so the racoons, in fact I can't see that they serve any usefoll purpose other than giving Davy Crockett a hat.:rolleyes:

[Charles]

Well the Good Lord was not kind when He deigned the poor possum but I will say this for them. They occasionally stop by to see if our feral cats have left any food as do the racoons. The possums are quiet, neat and don't leave a mess. Not so the racoons, in fact I can't see that they serve any usefoll purpose other than giving Davy Crockett a hat.:rolleyes:

I guess he left the tail on it so that everyone knew he wasn't wearing a possum.

Chas

[JJIII]

Anybody remember this guy? He was my favorite possum!

[Charles]

Anybody remember this guy? He was my favorite possum!

One of my favorites, along with the Far Side.

The good old days, whenever the best written and insightful pieces in the newspaper were on the funny pages.

Chas

[whell]

The CANDU heavy water reactor used in Canada, guess it is the usual not invented here deal. They sold them to India and they are planning to run them on Thorium. They regularly use un-enriched Uranium and could even burn the waste fuel from high pressure designs. Oh yes, in the event of a power failure all the control rods drop so it shuts down.

Based on the info I've seen, the CANDU has been comparatively overpriced (compared to hydro and coal - fired plants) and not nearly as reliable. Could be a reason that they've not exported that technology as much.

[bobabode]

Based on the info I've seen, the CANDU has been comparatively overpriced (compared to hydro and coal - fired plants) and not nearly as reliable. Could be a reason that they've not exported that technology as much.

Hydro is built out of course and comparing Candu plants or any other nuke plant to coal fired is a gross false equivalence ignoring the greenhouse pollution aspect of coal, Mike.

More reading from Wikipedia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CANDU_reactor
"Information on economic performance on CANDU is somewhat lopsided; the majority of reactors are in Ontario, which is also the "most public" among the major CANDU operators, so their performance dominates the available information. Based on Ontario's record, the economic performance of the CANDU system is quite poor. Although much attention has been focussed on the problems with the Darlington plant, in fact, every single CANDU design in Ontario went over budget by at least 25%, and average over 150% higher than estimated.[61] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CANDU_reactor#cite_note-apexa-61) Darlington was the worst offender, at 350% over budget, but this project was stopped in-progress thereby incurring additional interest charges during a period of high interest rates, which is a special situation that was not expected to repeat itself."

[merrylander]

Hydro is built out of course and comparing Candu plants or any other nuke plant to coal fired is a gross false equivalence ignoring the greenhouse pollution aspect of coal, Mike.

More reading from Wikipedia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CANDU_reactor
"Information on economic performance on CANDU is somewhat lopsided; the majority of reactors are in Ontario, which is also the "most public" among the major CANDU operators, so their performance dominates the available information. Based on Ontario's record, the economic performance of the CANDU system is quite poor. Although much attention has been focussed on the problems with the Darlington plant, in fact, every single CANDU design in Ontario went over budget by at least 25%, and average over 150% higher than estimated.[61] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CANDU_reactor#cite_note-apexa-61) Darlington was the worst offender, at 350% over budget, but this project was stopped in-progress thereby incurring additional interest charges during a period of high interest rates, which is a special situation that was not expected to repeat itself."

Now isn't it strange that these overpriced reactors delivered electricity to my home at such a low cost that they only read the meter every second month as it did not pay them to send a man around every month. They were also so unreliable that I suffered one power failure in the thirteen years we lived there.

Running air conditioning flat out (yes kiddies Ottawa is a hot and humid as DC) my two month bill there was still less than one month here.

You do realize that wikipedia accepts input from any source,

[Charles]

Hydro is built out of course and comparing Candu plants or any other nuke plant to coal fired is a gross false equivalence ignoring the greenhouse pollution aspect of coal, Mike.

More reading from Wikipedia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CANDU_reactor
"Information on economic performance on CANDU is somewhat lopsided; the majority of reactors are in Ontario, which is also the "most public" among the major CANDU operators, so their performance dominates the available information. Based on Ontario's record, the economic performance of the CANDU system is quite poor. Although much attention has been focussed on the problems with the Darlington plant, in fact, every single CANDU design in Ontario went over budget by at least 25%, and average over 150% higher than estimated.[61] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CANDU_reactor#cite_note-apexa-61) Darlington was the worst offender, at 350% over budget, but this project was stopped in-progress thereby incurring additional interest charges during a period of high interest rates, which is a special situation that was not expected to repeat itself."

If Bechtel had anything to do with it, it's a wonder it came in that cheap.

Chas

[merrylander]

Bechtel was not involved, here is a link for somewhere other than Wiki.

http://www.candu.com/en/home/default.aspx

[HarmanKardon]

The most important German weekly newspaper "Die Zeit" comments Obamas suggestions this way: "Obama ist eine lahme Ente" - "Obama is a lame duck". I know what this expression implies.

[merrylander]

The only lame duck here is Congress