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Charles
01-05-2010, 05:58 PM
Just thought I would point a few of the positive attributes of Richard Nixon.

1. He took the United States off of the gold standard.

2. He opened diplomatic relations with China.

3. He ended the Vietnam War.

4. Ain't NOBODY could flip the peace sign like Milhous!!!!

Feel free in helping me honor our distinguished 37th President.

Chas

Sandy G
01-05-2010, 06:27 PM
He provided employment for a rather large cottage industry of haters...Made the careers of Woodstein 'n' Bernward, along w/several others....Nixon's biggest problem, I think was that he was NOT a likable, charismatic person, was physically unattractive-it matters- A LOT-and always seemed to be hiding something, whether he actually was or not. LBJ was prolly as corrupt as Nixon was, & guilty of cranking up the Vietnam fiasco, but Johnson never came off as unlikable as Nixon did. Plus, Johnson was an old Washington hand, knew all the players, whereas Nixon was somewhat of an outsider, or at least had been since '60. Johnson was the kind of guy you could see yrself riding shotgun, while barrelling across his Texas ranch in his big Lincoln convertible, but Nixon was a cold fish who prolly never had a day of fun in his life.

finnbow
01-05-2010, 07:22 PM
What a lot of people may not remember is that Nixon founded the EPA and OSHA. Quite a dubious accomplishment for a Republican.

Boreas
01-05-2010, 07:36 PM
What a lot of people may not remember is that Nixon founded the EPA and OSHA. Quite a dubious accomplishment for a Republican.

Republicanism changed dramatically with Nixon. Guys like Goldwater were appalled.

John

Boreas
01-05-2010, 07:49 PM
He provided employment for a rather large cottage industry of haters...Made the careers of Woodstein 'n' Bernward, along w/several others....Nixon's biggest problem, I think was that he was NOT a likable, charismatic person, was physically unattractive-it matters- A LOT-and always seemed to be hiding something, whether he actually was or not.

Right. That was much more important like the illegal stuff like Watergate and the Ellsburg break-in and the bombing in Cambodia and Laos and the political dirty tricks and the.....

LBJ was prolly as corrupt as Nixon was, & guilty of cranking up the Vietnam fiasco, but Johnson never came off as unlikable as Nixon did.

"Prolly" doesn't cut it. If you're going to try to excuse Nixon on the basis of someone else being just as bad you need to be prepared to back it up.

Not that being no worse than "X" is any defense.

Plus, Johnson was an old Washington hand, knew all the players, whereas Nixon was somewhat of an outsider, or at least had been since '60. Johnson was the kind of guy you could see yrself riding shotgun, while barrelling across his Texas ranch in his big Lincoln convertible, but Nixon was a cold fish who prolly never had a day of fun in his life.

Are you old enough to remember this stuff? I am - old enough to have voted against the bastard.

Nixon was a congressman and a 2-term VP. He cut his political teeth in Congress with the HUAC shit and "Tail Gunner Joe" McCarthy. That's why he was on the ticket with Ike who was a little short on anti-red street cred. He was an experienced and ruthless politician who knew exactly how Washington worked.

John

Writewing
01-05-2010, 08:48 PM
Right. That was much more important like the illegal stuff like Watergate and the Ellsburg break-in and the bombing in Cambodia and Laos and the political dirty tricks and the.....



"Prolly" doesn't cut it. If you're going to try to excuse Nixon on the basis of someone else being just as bad you need to be prepared to back it up.

Not that being no worse than "X" is any defense.



Are you old enough to remember this stuff? I am - old enough to have voted against the bastard.

Nixon was a congressman and a 2-term VP. He cut his political teeth in Congress with the HUAC shit and "Tail Gunner Joe" McCarthy. That's why he was on the ticket with Ike who was a little short on anti-red street cred. He was an experienced and ruthless politician who knew exactly how Washington worked.

John

You say that likes its a bad thing;)

Charles
01-05-2010, 09:28 PM
Nixon was a congressman and a 2-term VP. He cut his political teeth in Congress with the HUAC shit and "Tail Gunner Joe" McCarthy. That's why he was on the ticket with Ike who was a little short on anti-red street cred. He was an experienced and ruthless politician who knew exactly how Washington worked.

John

So Nixon knew how to play the game. And no doubt Nixon, the HUAC, and Tail Gunner Joe shined a spotlight on the communists, but not without some reason. Ever hear of Project Verona?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venona_project

Were their actions political? Damn right about that. But communists have never been very popular in the United States, that's why they now run under the "Progressive" banner.

Personally, I've got nothing against the Communists, provided they show their cards and run as one. That's why I like Bernie Sanders, he ran as a Socialist and actually won. He has shown a considerable amount of honesty in my estimation.

Which is better than a large percentage of the Republicans and the Democrats.

And BTW, Johnson wasn't a virgin whenever it came to smash mouthed politics.

Chas

Boreas
01-05-2010, 09:51 PM
So Nixon knew how to play the game. And no doubt Nixon, the HUAC, and Tail Gunner Joe shined a spotlight on the communists, but not without some reason.

Communists like Pete Seeger? McCarthy was a demagogue and a fraud. He went after totally innocent people for his own personal power. He was responsible for uncovering exactly zero communists.

Ever hear of Project Verona?

Oh, yes. Absolutely. I'm not saying we had nothing to fear from communists.

Were their actions political? Damn right about that. But communists have never been very popular in the United States, that's why they now run under the "Progressive" banner.

Chas, Progressives and Communists have about as much in common as Conservatives and Fascists. Check out these:

http://cpusa.org/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communist_Party_USA

Personally, I've got nothing against the Communists, provided they show their cards and run as one. That's why I like Bernie Sanders, he ran as a Socialist and actually won. He has shown a considerable amount of honesty in my estimation.

Bernie's actually a Democratic Socialist, more or less in the European mold. He's really popular in his state, even among the more or less prehistoric conservatives who live up in the far north of the state. Bush got 80% of the vote and so did Sanders.

And BTW, Johnson wasn't a virgin whenever it came to smash mouthed politics.

Smash mouth? No, not smash mouth. Johnson used his fists. ;)

John

Sandy G
01-06-2010, 05:47 AM
Well, I am not old enuff to have voted for Nixon-I was 17 when he resigned, but I DO remember a lot of it. Nixon, IMHO, was NOT nearly as bad as some people still want to believe, had it not been for Watergate, he would have gone down as a foriegn policy master..He should have come clean on Watergate early, admitted to it, sacked Erlichman & Haldeman, & gone on w/life. The country survived Watergate, just as it managed to survive Chimpy McHalliburton Bushitler, Ronnie Ray-Gun, Slick Willy, & the current community-organiser-in-chief.

noonereal
01-06-2010, 06:49 AM
Well, I am not old enuff to have voted for Nixon-I was 17 when he resigned, but I DO remember a lot of it. Nixon, IMHO, was NOT nearly as bad as some people still want to believe, had it not been for Watergate, he would have gone down as a foriegn policy master..He should have come clean on Watergate early, admitted to it, sacked Erlichman & Haldeman, & gone on w/life. The country survived Watergate, just as it managed to survive Chimpy McHalliburton Bushitler, Ronnie Ray-Gun, Slick Willy, & the current community-organiser-in-chief.

Yep :)

noonereal
01-06-2010, 06:51 AM
Just thought I would point a few of the positive attributes of Richard Nixon.

1. He took the United States off of the gold standard.

2. He opened diplomatic relations with China.

3. He ended the Vietnam War.

4. Ain't NOBODY could flip the peace sign like Milhous!!!!

Feel free in helping me honor our distinguished 37th President.

Chas

I am guessing this was a "tea time" inspired post? :D

piece-itpete
01-06-2010, 07:30 AM
Yep :)

x2, seems that way to me too Sandy.

They wanted Nixon like they wanted Bush - he wasn't a Democrat.

But Bush was... smarter? ... smarter? than Nixon :D

John, LBJ was a connivin' backstabber. Just ask the honorable Rayburn.

Pete

merrylander
01-06-2010, 08:32 AM
I always got a laugh when Archie Bunker used to refer to him as Richard S. Nixon.

Boreas
01-06-2010, 09:40 AM
They wanted Nixon like they wanted Bush - he wasn't a Democrat.

Nixon resigned when he realized that the Republicans in the Senate were going to vote for his removal.

John

Charles
01-06-2010, 05:05 PM
I am guessing this was a "tea time" inspired post? :D

Nah, I just felt like causing some trouble.

Chas

Fast_Eddie
01-06-2010, 06:01 PM
Nixon is an iteresting character. *IF* you put asside all the really horrible things he did- and you can't really put them asside- but if you did, I like him as Republicans go. He even tried to fix health care and in a much more liberal manner than we're seeing now. Ironically, Kennedy killed it hoping for a better deal if they could get a Democrat in office. I've heard he said it was the biggest mistake he ever made.

Fast_Eddie
01-06-2010, 06:04 PM
But Bush was... smarter? ... smarter? than Nixon :D

Um. No.

d-ray657
01-06-2010, 07:10 PM
As I recall, Nixon imposed those socialist price controls during his administration, didn't he. I have to give him props for China though. Only Nixon had sufficient anti-communist credentials to initiate diplomatic relations with the communist government without being crucified by the right. It was almost like penance for his time with McCarthy.

Both Nixon and Johnson reveled in power. One of my favorite stories about Johnson doesn't play as well in this age of cell phones, but . . When LBJ was senate majority leader, he loved to one-up minority leader Everett Dirksen. At that time, having a telephone in the car was a real symbol of power. When Dirksen finally pulled all the strings necessary to get one, he called LBJ, car to car. Johnson answered and told him to hold on because his other phone was ringing.

Regards,

D-Ray

noonereal
01-06-2010, 08:35 PM
Nah, I just felt like causing some trouble.

Chas

You done good. ;)

Sandy G
01-07-2010, 05:55 AM
Another thing about LBJ was that he was a LARGE man, apparently very strong & physically intimidating, & he played THAT for all it was worth. His "Chair" in Air Force One was much larger than normal, & it was mounted in a way so that he would ALWAYS tower over everybody else in the plane. He could be almost unbelievably crude & vulgar, & he used THAT to intimidate people, too. Yet, LBJ, for all his peccadilloes, was the kind of a guy that people just wanted to be around-I imagine there was rarely a dull moment around him.

merrylander
01-07-2010, 07:33 AM
The republicans should be grateful to LBJ, after he signed the Civil Rights legislation he swelled their party ranks by the hundreds of thosands.:rolleyes:

piece-itpete
01-07-2010, 07:35 AM
Um. No.

Who got tossed out of office, and who won a war?

;)

Pete

d-ray657
01-08-2010, 12:16 AM
Another thing about LBJ was that he was a LARGE man, apparently very strong & physically intimidating, & he played THAT for all it was worth. His "Chair" in Air Force One was much larger than normal, & it was mounted in a way so that he would ALWAYS tower over everybody else in the plane. He could be almost unbelievably crude & vulgar, & he used THAT to intimidate people, too. Yet, LBJ, for all his peccadilloes, was the kind of a guy that people just wanted to be around-I imagine there was rarely a dull moment around him.

Yeah, interesting that someone who gave gawd-awful boring speeches had tremendous charisma -- The same thing could also be said about Clinton.

Regards,

D-Ray

BlueStreak
01-08-2010, 01:25 AM
The republicans should be grateful to LBJ, after he signed the Civil Rights legislation he swelled their party ranks by the hundreds of thosands.:rolleyes:

You wouldn't be suggesting all of the bigots, except Byrd maybe, went across the aisle are you? That wouldn't explain why all of the sheet wearing morons here in the swamp are proud Republicans would it?
Nahhh, say it isn't so!

Dave

BlueStreak
01-08-2010, 01:32 AM
Who got tossed out of office, and who won a war?

;)

Pete

A Republican won a war some time in the last hundred years?

Even before that the Reps that won a war were Lincoln and T.R.,
both men far too liberal for todays Republican standards.

Oh, I see. You're referring to that debacle in Iraq.
You call that victory? Yeah, yeah, Saddams dead. Whoopie ding.
Did that do anything to stop terrorism? Apparently not.

Dave

merrylander
01-08-2010, 07:40 AM
You wouldn't be suggesting all of the bigots, except Byrd maybe, went across the aisle are you? That wouldn't explain why all of the sheet wearing morons here in the swamp are proud Republicans would it?
Nahhh, say it isn't so!

Dave

Scratch a southern republican and you will find a dixicrat.:rolleyes:

Why do you think Senator Jim Demented has his knickers in such a twist.

Boreas
01-08-2010, 09:36 AM
Who got tossed out of office, and who won a war?

;)

Pete

Johnson didn't run so it's not exactly fair to say he "got tossed out".

We lost in Vietnam.

John

Grumpy
01-08-2010, 10:15 AM
Another thing about LBJ was that he was a LARGE man, apparently very strong & physically intimidating, & he played THAT for all it was worth. His "Chair" in Air Force One was much larger than normal, & it was mounted in a way so that he would ALWAYS tower over everybody else in the plane. He could be almost unbelievably crude & vulgar, & he used THAT to intimidate people, too. Yet, LBJ, for all his peccadilloes, was the kind of a guy that people just wanted to be around-I imagine there was rarely a dull moment around him.


I had to go back and reread that to make sure you werent talking bout me :D

piece-itpete
01-08-2010, 10:40 AM
Johnson didn't run so it's not exactly fair to say he "got tossed out".

We lost in Vietnam.

John

Sorry. Me and Eddie were having a very deep penetrating discussion of the merits of Bush vs Nixon:

Pete: But Bush was... smarter? ... smarter? than Nixon

Eddie: Um. No.

;)

Pete

Sandy G
01-08-2010, 11:37 AM
I had to go back and reread that to make sure you werent talking bout me :D

I can see that, but I think you are a lot taller than even LBJ was...IIRC, he was a mere 6'4"....There are NOT a lot of people I feel small around, Dave, but you are one of 'em...Now that I'm 125 lbs lighter, I'd prolly feel even punier...Oh, well...

Boreas
01-08-2010, 12:17 PM
Sorry. Me and Eddie were having a very deep penetrating discussion of the merits of Bush vs Nixon:

Pete: But Bush was... smarter? ... smarter? than Nixon

Eddie: Um. No.

;)

Pete

So, Bush won a war? Which one, the one against the frogs he used to blow up?

John

Sandy G
01-08-2010, 02:23 PM
So, Bush won a war? Which one, the one against the frogs he used to blow up?

John

I don't think either one of the Bushes ever went to war against France...Reagan did, however drop a bomb on their embassy in Lybia when they wouldn't let him fly the fighters thru France on their way to bomb Kadaffy.