Today's GOP

[bobabode]

BH, I'm trying to understand the rejection of collectivism by those of the libertarian persuasion. Isn't society itself a collective to some degree? I'm not talking about absolute collectivism (or Marxism as it's described by most libertarians.)
I've read a bit about libertarianism and some of it isn't too, too crazy but I see a bent towards absolutism in most libertarians that pisses me off. Not to mention a wacked idea that the world is going to descend into barbarism through totalitarianism. Isn't some sort of rational amalgamation of these differing philosophical concepts possible?
BTW I'm all ism'd out and the Young Turks is on. Watching ol' shifty eyed Ayn Rand has me feeling like I need a shower. Did you watch that interview BH?

[Rex E.]

Originally Posted by BlueStreak

Case in point; Watch the Tea Party backed Republicans. These guys were supposed to be going to Washingiton to straighten out the GOP and take on the Dems.....Change the way Washington works, etc., etc..............

Are they refusing congreesional perks and privledges? Are they refusing lobbyist and Superpac money and favors? Huh?

Oh, my how we have taken to doing as the Romans do, once we have entered into Rome.................

Dave

IIRC most of them loaded up their offices with lobbyists quicker than you can say "tea party".

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by bhunter

I'm not enamored with either party. I dislike the collectivist attributes of the democrats and dislike the neo-religious attributes of the GOP. Interestingly, John Stossel recently said this:

I concur with his position in that I prefer to be left alone and not bothered by the wants of either party. In essence, I want a small fiscally conservative government and one not concerned with the promotion of religious ideals together with a myriad of midsize businesses competing amongst themselves. Currently, I believe it's more expedient to keep the GOP out of the bedroom than the Democrats out of the wallet.

Excellent post (as it largely represents my own POV, except for the reference to Stossel. He's a first class idiot). Also, I remain unconvinced that the GOP is the party of fiscal responsibility given their recent history, knee-jerk approval of all Defense spending (and/or increases), and their thinly veiled fealty to corporate America.

[merrylander]

Originally Posted by whell

Is that right? How do you figure that a tax structure where the wealthy have the greatest share of the total tax burden is somehow unfair to them?

Because they also have the greatest share of the national income, absent the trickle down bit.

[BlueStreak]

Originally Posted by ebacon

We probably would all go for those ideals if they worked. But they don't anymore. They might work if we were all farmers or other manual laborers that woke up every day with something to do. But that's not the way it is anymore.

What we have now are machines that make stuff really fast. Management tries to predict how much stuff to make and if it doesn't sell then inventory piles up. At some point inventory piles up so much that management has to turn off the machines. People get laid off. At that point the taxes paid into unemployment get paid back to the workers to tide them over until demand comes back and management turns the machines back on.

It's not a bad system. In the auto industry the cycle used to be on a ten year cycle with about nine good years for every year that went to pot. That used to be called decent economic management since it used savings to smooth boom and bust cycles.

The modern right seems to say to workers, look man, management totally screwed the pooch on market forecasts. You are stupid for working for them and therefore should have done better. No soup for you. In the meantime management says hmmm, we should get a retainer bonus for sticking around to fix what we broke and oh, by the way, thanks workers for paying taxes to bail us out.

That kind of thought is a recipe for disaster, as in worker revolt.

It SHOULD be, but unfortunately is not.....For the time being. Mainly because the workforce is still full of 40-50 somethings brainwashed Reaganites who still think it's someone else the GOP is out to fleece. They haven't yet figured out that "the rich" and the boss, don't really give a shit about them.

But, this can't last forever.

In a plant meeting held by our production manager recently, we were told;

"First of all, you are no longer individuals......."...Seriously, that was the opening line to his little speech. Whatever he said after that, I couldn't tell you. I was no longer listening to the Fascist prick. I couldn't believe what I had just heard.

Dave

[Rex E.]

Originally Posted by BlueStreak

It SHOULD be, but unfortunately is not.....For the time being. Mainly because the workforce is still full of 40-50 something brainwashed Reaganites who still think it's someone else the GOP is out to fleece. They haven't yet figured out that "the rich" and the boss, don't really give a shit about them.

But, this can't last forever.

In a plant meeting held by our production manager recently, we were told;

"First of all, you are no longer individuals......."...Seriously, that was the opening line to his little speech. Whatever he said after that, I couldn't tell you. I was no longer listening to the Fascist prick. I couldn't believe what I had just heard.

Dave

Standard in the corporate world Dave. It's "One Team" until you make a mistake then you find out you really can put the "I" in team.

[BlueStreak]

Originally Posted by Rex E.

Standard in the corporate world Dave. It's "One Team" until you make a mistake then you find out you really can put the "I" in team.

You got that right.

[wgrr]

Originally Posted by beej

I'd like to make a point here. Condemning Medicare as 'government solution' while supporting a tax structure that is extraordinarily favorable to the wealthy, by any measure a 'government solution', is simply hypocritical.

Moreover, Paul Ryan is no more a fiscal conservative than I'm the second coming of Eldridge Cleaver. A true fiscal conservative would not have supported George W. Bush's tax cuts while at the same time voting in favor of a two front war that was going to balloon the deficit. That's not fiscal conservatism by any measure. A true fiscal conservative would have insisted that the wars, assuming they were necessary, be paid for.

You forgot Medicare part D..ebt. Why pay for any of it. It never appeared on the books during W's two terms. It was all done off the books. The debt did not exist until Obama took office and had the guts to put W's spending spree on the books. Sad thing is Obama got blamed for the debt.

Wake up folks. Romney/Ryan ain't gonna save you. They will increase your tax load while giving themselves historically lower tax rates. This assumes the Republicans take the House and Senate.

[Twodogs]

All this republican hate, does anyone here make over 200k (combined with the wife)? I'm just trying to figure out this whole democrat thing.

[merrylander]

TD it is not hate it is simply that if we are going to be screwed it would be nice to be kissed first.