GOP to Jobless: Drop Dead

[whell]

Just feeding my need to be devils advocate here:

Let's just tax anyone making over $250K at 100%. Let's just quit messing around and do it right once and for all. Those rich bastards probably just screwed someone else and took their money and called it "making a profit", so lets just fix 'em and tax 'em at 100%.

"...let high-end tax rates return to where they were during the Clinton years and use the $65 billion in additional income over the next two years for tax breaks for businesses that increase investments or hire new employees. After that, the extra revenue would go toward deficit reduction."

Well, hell, Health Care Reform takes virtually all of top earners’ ordinary income tax to 44.6 percent, starting in 2013 with the increase in the Medicare tax. Going back now to the Clinton-era rates of 40.8 and 43.7 percent in the top brackets would essentially give Obama his wish a couple years early.

And does anyone really believe that the BEST path to deficit reduction is raising taxes? We're already in a recession, so lets take money out of the economy where it might actually be put to use, just so we can make government flush?

[d-ray657]

Originally Posted by whell

Just feeding my need to be devils advocate here:

Let's just tax anyone making over $250K at 100%. Let's just quit messing around and do it right once and for all. Those rich bastards probably just screwed someone else and took their money and called it "making a profit", so lets just fix 'em and tax 'em at 100%.

"...let high-end tax rates return to where they were during the Clinton years and use the $65 billion in additional income over the next two years for tax breaks for businesses that increase investments or hire new employees. After that, the extra revenue would go toward deficit reduction."

Well, hell, Health Care Reform takes virtually all of top earners’ ordinary income tax to 44.6 percent, starting in 2013 with the increase in the Medicare tax. Going back now to the Clinton-era rates of 40.8 and 43.7 percent in the top brackets would essentially give Obama his wish a couple years early.

And does anyone really believe that the BEST path to deficit reduction is raising taxes? We're already in a recession, so lets take money out of the economy where it might actually be put to use, just so we can make government flush?

It's gonna take both taxes and cuts. Your numbers sound fishy to me. What is the 44.6% composed of? Most of the numbers I've seen shows that actual rate collected from the top incomes in the 20's.

Regards,

D-Ray

[whell]

Originally Posted by d-ray657

It's gonna take both taxes and cuts. Your numbers sound fishy to me. What is the 44.6% composed of? Most of the numbers I've seen shows that actual rate collected from the top incomes in the 20's.

Regards,

D-Ray

Current Highest Federal income tax rate = 35%
FICA Tax = 6.2%
Medicare Tax = 1.45%
Total tax on income - 42.65

Under PPACA, the Medicare tax will increase to 2.35% for income earned over $200K. Total income tax = 43.35%

That's the story for taxes on income. Individuals who have a combination of W-2 income and investment income (or just investment income) will pay an additional Medicare tax of 3.8% under changes enacted by PPACA. This could push their total tax rate up towards the 44.6% level.

[Fast_Eddie]

Originally Posted by whell

Current Highest Federal income tax rate = 35%
FICA Tax = 6.2%
Medicare Tax = 1.45%
Total tax on income - 42.65

Let's try this, because I think I now understand what you mean. A hypothetical example. You believe there is an American, let's call him Rube, who has a sallary of $275,000 a year. If I follow you, you believe that Rube had deducted from his check, or pays at tax time a total of 275,000 * 42.65%. Right? You think Rube pays the government $117,287 a year?

Using the IRS Calculator for our friend Rube "Your anticipated income tax is $72,781" again assuming NO deductions, single, no contributions to tax deferred... etc. Again, NO ONE does that. Zero people. But even with that, 72,781/275,000= 26.4%.

Is there some Tea Party propoganda that leads you to believe this? If so, I can see why they're so angy. They think people are paying insane amounts of tax, almost higher than anyone in the world!

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by Fast_Eddie

Let's try this, because I think I now understand what you mean. A hypothetical example. You believe there is an American, let's call him Rube, who has a sallary of $275,000 a year. If I follow you, you believe that Rube had deducted from his check, or pays at tax time a total of 275,000 * 42.65%. Right? You think Rube pays the government $117,287 a year?

Using the IRS Calculator for our friend Rube "Your anticipated income tax is $72,781" again assuming NO deductions, single, no contributions to tax deferred... etc. Again, NO ONE does that. Zero people. But even with that, 72,781/275,000= 26.4%.

Damn you, Eddie, with all your fact-based arguments!
You shouldn't let truth get in the way of indulging in a good fantasy.

[Fast_Eddie]

Originally Posted by finnbow

Damn you, Eddie, with all your fact-based arguments!
You shouldn't let truth get in the way of indulging in a good fantasy.

Man, I'm pretty sure that's what he meant. No wonder he thinks taxes are too high. I'd be marching on Washington myself if I paid 40% of my income in taxes.

[whell]

Originally Posted by Fast_Eddie

Let's try this, because I think I now understand what you mean. A hypothetical example. You believe there is an American, let's call him Rube, who has a sallary of $275,000 a year. If I follow you, you believe that Rube had deducted from his check, or pays at tax time a total of 275,000 * 42.65%. Right? You think Rube pays the government $117,287 a year?

Using the IRS Calculator for our friend Rube "Your anticipated income tax is $72,781" again assuming NO deductions, single, no contributions to tax deferred... etc. Again, NO ONE does that. Zero people. But even with that, 72,781/275,000= 26.4%.

Is there some Tea Party propoganda that leads you to believe this? If so, I can see why they're so angy. They think people are paying insane amounts of tax, almost higher than anyone in the world!

If you want to try calculating it with actual wages, the 35% tax bracket starts with income earned above $373650/yr. And yes, individuals do earn and are taxed on income at that level. Also, the increased Medicare withholding on wages/investment income starts in 2013, so that may be why you're not finding it in 2010 tax calculation data.

[Fast_Eddie]

Originally Posted by whell

Also, the increased Medicare withholding on wages/investment income starts in 2013, so that may be why you're not finding it in 2010 tax calculation data.

Yeah...

Originally Posted by whell

Current Highest Federal income tax rate = 35%
FICA Tax = 6.2%
Medicare Tax = 1.45%
Total tax on income - 42.65

Under PPACA, the Medicare tax will increase to 2.35% for income earned over $200K. Total income tax = 43.35%

You were talking about 2010 when you said 42.65.

[Fast_Eddie]

Originally Posted by whell

Just feeding my need to be devils advocate here:

Let's just tax anyone making over $250K at 100%.

Well, I know you're playing devil's advocate, but no one said anything like that. I've defended, for instance, Reagan dropping the top tax rate from 70 to 50%. At that time, 50% top bracket was considered an historic move down. I'm not buying this 46% rate you speak of, but what if that were the case? It's still lower than the rate Reagan initially dropped it to.

It's not an all or nothing deal. It's kind of silly to say that anything above 30% might as well be 100%.

If this 46% number is legit, I'd like to see some documentation. I might could think that was high. Not sure. But I don't believe it unless I see it. I haven't heard anything close to that.

Take care,

Ed

[noonereal]

Originally Posted by whell

And does anyone really believe that the BEST path to deficit reduction is raising taxes?

hook line and sinker

honest Whell this is just shocking