Another Mass Shooting in the Good Ol' USA

[Pio1980]

Originally Posted by piece-itpete

What legislation would have stopped this shooting?

An answer in the specific is difficult to impossible for a determined assailant.
Maybe a better question would be,
"What legislation could impede mass shootings like these?"

[Ike Bana]

Originally Posted by piece-itpete

What legislation would have stopped this shooting?

Legislation like that passed in the UK in 1996 after the first, and only, mass school shooting there...the Dunblane massacre in Dunblane, Scotland. Within a year, the UK passed laws outlawing public ownership of all guns outside of long barreled non-automatic loading hunting rifles and shotguns. Of course, the firearms homicide rate in the UK was never anything like we have here, pete. But right now, 25 years since Dunblane, the firearms murder rate here has exploded to forty times the rate in the UK. Forty fucking times.

And in Sweden it's most interesting. No handguns, no assault weapons only hunting rifles. Hunting is very popular in Sweden and the Swede's have accepted the extreme requirements and regulations that must be met and adhered to in order to qualify to own a hunting rifle and keep your hunting rifle. It takes a long time, it's expensive, and you are required to re-file for your firearms license yearly and pay the stiff fee for the license. And what happens if you don't re-apply and pay the license fee? The cops come to your house and confiscate your guns. You fill out the paperwork and pay the fee and you get your guns back. If you don't re-file and pay within the prescribed period of time. the confiscation becomes permanent.

That sort of legislation, pete.

One last thing, pete. In 2020 for the first time, gunshot became the most common cause of death in American children. Death by fucking gunshot. More than vehicular accidents, more than drownings, more than illness or disease...GUNSHOT. Despicable and among first world nations of course...ONLY IN AMERICA.

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by piece-itpete

What legislation would have stopped this shooting?

Since you've chosen to get so specific:
1. Raise purchase age to 21 (he was 18 as was the kid in Buffalo).
2. Red flag law (he showed self-destructive and violent signs like self-mutilation).
3. Forbid autoloading firearms and limit magazine capacity to 5 rounds (federal law already restricts magazine capacity to 3 rounds to hunt migratory game birds (ducks, geese, doves and they're harder to hit than humans)).
4. In keeping with strict conservative constitutional originalism, restrict unlimited firearms access to flintlocks only (I'm joking here, but conservatives always insist adamantly upon originalism).

[BigElCat]

Originally Posted by finnbow

Since you've chosen to get so specific:
1. Raise purchase age to 21 (he was 18 as was the kid in Buffalo).
2. Red flag law (he showed self-destructive and violent signs like self-mutilation).
3. Forbid autoloading firearms and limit magazine capacity to 5 rounds (federal law already restricts magazine capacity to 3 rounds to hunt migratory game birds (ducks, geese, doves and they're harder to hit than humans)).
4. In keeping with strict conservative constitutional originalism, restrict unlimited firearms access to flintlocks only (I'm joking here, but conservatives always insist adamantly upon originalism).

Now this is sensible. All this military-like crap in the hands of the US public is the work of the devil.

I'm open to negotiation, I'll keep my mag fed AR shotgun. Turn in the mags over 5 rounds.

[Ike Bana]

Originally Posted by finnbow

Since you've chosen to get so specific:
1. Raise purchase age to 21 (he was 18 as was the kid in Buffalo).
2. Red flag law (he showed self-destructive and violent signs like self-mutilation).
3. Forbid autoloading firearms and limit magazine capacity to 5 rounds (federal law already restricts magazine capacity to 3 rounds to hunt migratory game birds (ducks, geese, doves and they're harder to hit than humans)).
4. In keeping with strict conservative constitutional originalism, restrict unlimited firearms access to flintlocks only (I'm joking here, but conservatives always insist adamantly upon originalism).

Originally Posted by BigElCat

Now this is sensible. All this military-like crap in the hands of the US public is the work of the devil.

I'm open to negotiation, I'll keep my mag fed AR shotgun. Turn in the mags over 5 rounds.

All the stuff in Finn's list is good stuff. Number 4 may be tongue in cheek, but accurate nonetheless. The constitutional originalism amongst American cons is amongst the most hypocritical of their blather. And number 3 would just about do it.

Auto-loading is the problem. But magazine loading, even limited to 3 or 5 rounds...that's three or five children dead, and a magazine can be pit out and replaced in 3 to 5 seconds, so then it's six to ten dead children, nine to fifteen dead children, etc., etc. Nope...no magazine loaded weapons. And since all handguns outside of muzzle loaded flintlocks are auto-loading firearms (revolvers auto-load), handguns should be forbidden as well. If you want a long barreled hunting rifle or shotgun single shot. If you're a hunter who knows how to shoot, and if you're a hunter with a conscience, you don't take a shot unless you know it's going to take down the game. Break down shotguns and single shot hunting rifles are all one needs when they're out to kill something.

Red-flag laws should be in place...but making red-flag laws and expanded background checks the end-all for this problem, like certain cons are suggesting? Nope. Red-flag laws and expanded background checks considering the extent of this problem, is like trying to patch a crack in the Hoover Dam with a wad of Juicyfruit gum.

[BigElCat]

Originally Posted by Ike Bana

And since all handguns outside of muzzle loaded flintlocks are auto-loading firearms (revolvers auto-load), handguns should be forbidden as well.

Well, you're wrong on this point. Revolvers don't auto-load, with the exception of a few collector items.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automatic_revolver

And, if I may borrow your 'style' of logic; since you're wrong about this, that means you're wrong about everything. Therefore, everyone should be required to carry a handgun.

[Not Insane]

Originally Posted by finnbow

Since you've chosen to get so specific:
1. Raise purchase age to 21 (he was 18 as was the kid in Buffalo).
2. Red flag law (he showed self-destructive and violent signs like self-mutilation).
3. Forbid autoloading firearms and limit magazine capacity to 5 rounds (federal law already restricts magazine capacity to 3 rounds to hunt migratory game birds (ducks, geese, doves and they're harder to hit than humans)).
4. In keeping with strict conservative constitutional originalism, restrict unlimited firearms access to flintlocks only (I'm joking here, but conservatives always insist adamantly upon originalism).

On the surface that list actually "seems" fairly reasonable. But it's a bit like saying that because a 19 year old went on a rampage in his car, running down pedestrians and if we had prevented people from driving until they are 21 and reduced maximum speeds of cars to 5 mph, none of those people would have been mowed down.

But it misses the point. Obviously. Bad actors are gonna be bad actors. It's best if the rest of us, and ESPECIALLY THE POLICE, have the means and (in the case of the police in this case) THE WILL to do something to stop bad actors. And it might also be prudent to try to understand why our culture is producing so many bad actors these days. I have my own theories, and I'm sure you've heard them before. But they do address attributes most of these bad actors have in common.

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by Not Insane

But it misses the point. Obviously. Bad actors are gonna be bad actors. It's best if the rest of us, and ESPECIALLY THE POLICE, have the means and (in the case of the police in this case) THE WILL to do something to stop bad actors. And it might also be prudent to try to understand why our culture is producing so many bad actors these days. I have my own theories, and I'm sure you've heard them before. But they do address attributes most of these bad actors have in common.

There is no data to suggest that we have more bad actors per capita than other industrialized democracies. We do, however, have far more guns per capita as well as a perverse gun culture that help enable our bad actors to take up arms against their fellow citizens whenever they feel aggrieved about anything.

[RickeyM]

Originally Posted by finnbow

There is no data to suggest that we have more bad actors per capita than other industrialized democracies. We do, however, have far more guns per capita as well as a perverse gun culture that help enable our bad actors to take up arms against their fellow citizens whenever they feel aggrieved about anything.

Inescapable fact: The U.S. has more gun violence and murders by gun that every other nation in the world. If more guns/easier access to guns would make us safer we'd be the safest place on the planet. We aren't. One party has been at the forefront in opposing gun control in any form and spreading the fear that without guns we have everything to fear.

[Pio1980]

Fwiw;
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news...pend-rcna30557

Meanwhile, passing draconian abortion prohibition is not a problem for "pro-life" hypocrites.