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05-03-2017, 10:13 AM
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Metro Detroit
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrPots
Republicans despise anything that's good and decent.
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We must really like you, then.
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05-03-2017, 10:26 AM
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Join Date: Aug 2010
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I'm not aware of any studies that have looked at the relationship between medical bankruptcies and the advent of Obamacare. The graph in the OP from Consumer Reports simply counts ALL bankruptcies, not specifically medical bankruptcies, charts the number of total bankruptcies decreasing, and suggests that Obamacare has something to do with it. Hardly a work of scholarly research, IMHO.
On the other hand, there was a study that looked at the rate of MEDICAL BANKRUPTCIES in Massachusetts to determine if Romneycare had might have caused a reduction in MEDICAL bankruptcies. According to that study:
Results
In 2009, illness and medical bills contributed to 52.9% of Massachusetts bankruptcies, versus 59.3% of the bankruptcies in the state in 2007 (P=.44) and 62.1% nationally in 2007 (P<.02). Between 2007 and 2009, total bankruptcy filings in Massachusetts increased 51%, an increase that was somewhat less than the national norm. (The Massachusetts increase was lower than in 54 of the 93 other bankruptcy districts.) Overall, the total number of medical bankruptcies in Massachusetts increased by more than one third during that period. In 2009, 89% of debtors and all their dependents had health insurance at the time of filing, whereas one quarter of bankrupt families had experienced a recent lapse in coverage.
Conclusion
Massachusetts' health reform has not decreased the number of medical bankruptcies, although the medical bankruptcy rate in the state was lower than the national rate both before and after the reform.
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05-03-2017, 10:29 AM
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 13,362
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Yeah, they probably didn't include Trump's many bankruptcies in the CR study, lol.
__________________
"In a time of deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act." -
George Orwell
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05-03-2017, 10:33 AM
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Aug 2010
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Also, here's a tidbit from the NY Times from a year and a half ago, which was two years after the implementation of the shared responsibility provisions of the ACA.
The number of uninsured Americans has fallen by an estimated 15 million since 2013, thanks largely to the Affordable Care Act. But a new survey, the first detailed study of Americans struggling with medical bills, shows that insurance often fails as a safety net. Health plans often require hundreds or thousands of dollars in out-of-pocket payments — sums that can create a cascade of financial troubles for the many households living paycheck to paycheck.
...and this:
In the new poll, conducted by The New York Times and the Kaiser Family Foundation, roughly 20 percent of people under age 65 with health insurance nonetheless reported having problems paying their medical bills over the last year. By comparison, 53 percent of people without insurance said the same.
...and finally this:
These financial vulnerabilities reflect the high costs of health care in the United States, the most expensive place in the world to get sick. They also highlight a substantial shift in the nature of health insurance. Since the late 1990s, insurance plans have begun asking their customers to pay an increasingly greater share of their bills out of pocket though rising deductibles and co-payments. The Affordable Care Act, signed by President Obama in 2010, protected many Americans from very high health costs by requiring insurance plans to be more comprehensive, but at the same time it allowed or even encouraged increases in deductibles.
Now, none of this is particularly great news. But it does underscore the "BS factor" of CR posting a graph attempting to support the idea that Obamacare has somehow fixed the underlying issue with the US health care system, which is COST OF CARE not lack of coverage.
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05-03-2017, 10:37 AM
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Aug 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chicks
Yeah, they probably didn't include Trump's many bankruptcies in the CR study, lol.
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First, CR didn't do a "study". They did a counting exercise. Second, since Trump's last bankruptcy was in 2009, that single bankruptcy was only one of 1.412 million bankruptcies that occurred that year.
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05-03-2017, 01:08 PM
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Admin
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Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Behind the Orange Curtain in California
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barbara
Thanks for the information, Bob.
Inadequate health care has been the cause of bankruptcy far too long.
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You're welcome, Barbara.
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I don't know half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
- Mr. Underhill
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05-03-2017, 01:10 PM
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Admin
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Join Date: Dec 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whell
First, CR didn't do a "study". They did a counting exercise.
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It's a shame that math has such a liberal bias, eh?
__________________
I don't know half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
- Mr. Underhill
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05-03-2017, 01:13 PM
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Sierras
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobabode
It's a shame that math has such a liberal bias, eh?
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Predictable deflection, don't agree with the result, question the math.
__________________
White Christian Nationalism:
Freedom for us, order for everyone else, and violence for those who transgress.
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05-03-2017, 01:24 PM
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Metro Detroit
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobabode
It's a shame that math has such a liberal bias, eh?
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I don't dispute their math. I did dispute their premise and their methodology.
I think the BS factor in the CR image you provided has been pretty thoroughly exposed here. I've explained it quite clearly, and even countered CR's "counting exercise" links to research and a NY Times piece which pretty thoroughly puts the lie to CR's little graph.
But hey, Bob, don't let me stand in your way if you want to stand by the BS.
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05-03-2017, 09:20 PM
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Admin
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Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Behind the Orange Curtain in California
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whell
I don't dispute their math. I did dispute their premise and their methodology.
I think the BS factor in the CR image you provided has been pretty thoroughly exposed here. I've explained it quite clearly, and even countered CR's "counting exercise" links to research and a NY Times piece which pretty thoroughly puts the lie to CR's little graph.
But hey, Bob, don't let me stand in your way if you want to stand by the BS.
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You haven't proven shit, Mike. All you've done is to wave your hands about while bloviating hysterically. I suggest you go read the whole article.
__________________
I don't know half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
- Mr. Underhill
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