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  #31  
Old 01-24-2015, 01:45 PM
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CarlV CarlV is offline
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I will freely admit I think it is wrong, wrong, wrong to give big oil a free ride, besides the tax credits to billionaires, with no accountability for failures in the pipeline. Or to replace it when it's lifetime is up, usually 40 years.
I don't really care if the Republicans call it the Keystone Jobs Bill, they are not ever be honest as long as they are owned by the Koch Brothers anyway. Yessir, those 35-40 permanent jobs will really save the day here lol. Oh I forgot, it is the 2500 temporary jobs that will do it.......

Bottom line, if they build the pipeline they should own all that goes with responsible ownership.


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  #32  
Old 01-24-2015, 02:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Dondilion View Post
I tend to side with whiny environmentalists.
Erring on the side of caution is a sound engineering principle.
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  #33  
Old 01-24-2015, 02:20 PM
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I tend to side with whiny environmentalists.
I'm a lover of the outdoors, have done significant coursework in pretty much all the environmental disciplines, and have have consulted on a number of Superfund projects and was involved in the nationwide clean-up of DOE Manhattan Project sites for over two decades. I've been personally involved in the most environmentally fucked up stuff you can imagine (e.g., the Hanford Site's tank farms).

In my experience, many self-described or activist environmentalists seem to feel that they have the luxury of not needing to recognize real world constraints or needs for energy, infrastructure and the like. In their perfect worlds, we would have all the energy and infrastructure we need without ever having to build it or consider unavoidable trade-offs. Many so-called environmentalists have about as much experience in environmental management as PETA types have in wildlife management (which I believe is also true of most single-issue activists).
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Last edited by finnbow; 01-24-2015 at 02:30 PM.
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  #34  
Old 01-24-2015, 02:39 PM
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Dondilion Dondilion is offline
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Originally Posted by finnbow View Post
I'm a lover of the outdoors, have done significant coursework in pretty much all the environmental disciplines, and have have consulted on a number of Superfund projects and was involved in the nationwide clean-up of DOE Manhattan Project sites for over two decades. I've been personally involved in the most environmentally fucked up stuff you can imagine (e.g., the Hanford Site's tank farms).

In my experience, many self-described or activist environmentalists seem to feel that they have the luxury of not needing to recognize real world constraints or needs for energy, infrastructure and the like. In their perfect worlds, we would have all the energy and infrastructure we need without ever having to build it or consider unavoidable trade-offs. Many so-called environmentalists have about as much experience in environmental management as PETA types have in wildlife management (which I believe is also true of most single-issue activists).
I still like the fact that they often force the big boys to give some account to the public.

They engender distillation.
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  #35  
Old 01-24-2015, 02:41 PM
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I still like the fact that they often force the big boys to give some account to the public.

They engender distillation.
As long as their positions/arguments remain credible, yes. If it's pie-in-the-sky PETA-like silliness, not so much.
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  #36  
Old 01-24-2015, 02:43 PM
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We could have lots of power except for the not invented here syndrome. The CANDU nuclear reactor does not need enriched uranium (in fact it could use up all the high pressure reactors spent fuel) and it is designed to fail safe unlike Fukushima. The fuel control rods are held up by electro-magnets, if the power fails they drop and shut down the reaction.

Of course we need oil and such but at least lets not be stupid about it. Pipelines can be made pretty safe but frex when natural gas was introduced into cities that previously ran coal gas there were problems. Natural gas is a scrubber, it will clean out years of crud and polish the interior of a pipe like Brasso. In the process it will find every pinhole in the pipe and welds. Once it escapes all it takes is a spark and Boom.
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  #37  
Old 01-29-2015, 11:18 PM
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Senate version was passed today by a vote of 62-36. Now the House is looking to mege their version or pass the Senate version. Obama is still poised to veto this for now I think and this is usurping his executive authority.

What really gets me is that Sen. Claire McCaskill who voted for this bill said this: "I was proud to vote to approve Keystone, which passed the Senate with a bipartisan 62-36 vote."

Hos is this bi-partisan when just a handful of Democrats joined the Republicans and they are probably from the states that the pipeline will go through.

http://stlouis.cbslocal.com/2015/01/...ense-approach/
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