We are NEVER wrong............................!

[Charles]

Originally Posted by BlueStreak

I love to insult and belittle the right. And I really don't blame them when they fire back.

"They smote me hip and thigh, and right merrily did I return the blows!"
------John L. Lewis

Troublemaker!!!!!!

Chas

[Combwork]

First sorry about the mixed up italics; I can't find how to switch part of them off. Suffice to say blue writing is from thee to me; black writing from me to thee...........

Originally Posted by noonereal

You're missing my point. It was never the case where you could smack someone else's child, but again in the 1950's/early 60's it was not unknown for the local 'Bobby' (Policeman) to clip a truant round the ear (not hard, just enough to emphasis that they shouldn't be playing in bombed out buildings, nicking apples off market stalls etc.). The alternative would have been to take them to the Police station, charge them with trespass or theft, drag their parents in to pick them up (believe me; that could earn them a lot more than a clip round the ear), take them to Court, fine them (which their parents would have had to pay) and give them a criminal record.

Quote again.

God would not be able to help you if you raised a hand to one to my kids. I am not a blow hard and I am dead serious.

What do you think of corporal punishment in schools? Now it's outlawed in the U.K. but up to the 1960's a lot of schools used it. Scottish schools were harder than English schools. Luckily I wasn't educated here but a friend of mine was. On his first day at secondary school he and all the other new boys were lined up, told to hold their hands out and given one hard swipe with the Tawse (split ended cane). Then they were told that if they misbehaved they'd get more. It's traditional for blowhards my age to say something like "I got the cane several times when I was at school and it never did me any harm". My reply to that is as they have no base for comparison, how could they possibly know?

Quote again again.

God would not be able to help you if you raised a hand to one to my kids. I am not a blow hard and I am dead serious.[/QUOTE]

What would you do if the local school bully persistently hurt your daughter, and his parents were unwilling (or unable) to control him? If you saw him hurting her again would you haul him off her and when he used foul language and promised to 'get her when your back was turned', maybe lose your temper and hit him?

I was in a position like this. After we moved house my daughter went to a new school with a useless head teacher. He refused to accept the playground was run by a group of bullies; one boy in particular. My daughter was the new kid on the block, the target. After the school did nothing, I managed to get her back to her old school. She was a lot happier until she went to a local dance. The bully was there and gave her a hard time. Evening ruined; no social life (she was 13), back to square one.

I'd had enough so I 'phoned the boys parents, spoke to his mother (his father was out) and told her if her son ever went near my daughter again, I'd bounce him up one side of the school playground and down the other. Half an hour later her husband 'phoned me back and said if I ever touched his son he'd put me in hospital (your attitude?) so I said OK, I'll be round your house in half an hour. My wife tried to stop me but like I said, I'd had enough.

Amazingly, when I got there no blows were exchanged; instead we started to talk. Turns out his son though physically strong, was weak willed and did what his sister told him to do (she was a seriously nasty piece of work). The father was badly beaten by HIS father when he was a child so would not even raise his voice to his son. The mother ruled the roost and thought both her children were 'little angels'. Since I talked to both parents, the boy never touched my daughter again so tell me. What would you have done in my situation?

[finnbow]

Back to the OP. I think the folks that (over)react to what they see as apologies by Obama have largely fallen victim to the "American exceptionalism" argument. Namely, they see America as inherently better than other nations, with loftier ideals, purer motivations, etc. (they relish the shining city on the hill metaphor). This nationalistic poppycock limits their ability to recognize where and when we screw up in international affairs. This myopia also results in the inability to learn valuable lessons from poorly executed international entanglements.

These "apologies" by Obama are nothing more than his acknowledgment of some of these screw-ups to people outside our borders who have long since been keenly aware of them. He's basically showing himself to be realist with some knowledge of history and diplomacy rather than an ideological and antagonistic dolt.

[noonereal]

Originally Posted by Combwork

I would do exactly what you did. I though I had made that clear.

I sure as hell would.

No. If my kid was the aggressor I would handle it and make amends for his actions.

I think you make an excellent case for not beating kids.

As to cops or teachers hitting kids, ridiculous and a recipe for abuse.

There is a thread here dealing with schools that still practice this archaic ritual. It seems the same folks who resit all change what to keep smacking 40pound kids. Go figure, not mine.

[noonereal]

Originally Posted by finnbow

Back to the OP. I think the folks that (over)react to what they see as apologies by Obama have largely fallen victim to the "American exceptionalism" argument. Namely, they see America as inherently better than other nations, with loftier ideals, purer motivations, etc. (they relish the shining city on the hill metaphor). This nationalistic poppycock limits their ability to recognize where and when we screw up in international affairs. This myopia also results in the inability to learn valuable lessons from poorly executed international entanglements.

These "apologies" by Obama are nothing more than his acknowledgment of some of these screw-ups to people outside our borders who have long since been keenly aware of them. He's basically showing himself to be realist with some knowledge of history and diplomacy rather than an ideological and antagonistic dolt.

+1

...

[HatchetJack]

The Civil War was more about power, money, greed, food and cotton than
about slavery. Cotton was king kinda like oil is now. The power and the money
was in the south so the United States blockaded the ports and invaded.
Sound famaliar? Dont get me wrong, slavery was a terrible thing but not as
bad as it has been portrayed in hollywood. I'm sure there were some bad
plantation owners but mostly they were well treated and cared for. It was
worse to just turn them loose on the inner citys to hustle. Just another
liberation cause to start a war. Slavery would have disolved itself with the
invention of modern machinery anyway. I had family members on both sides
of the war. One, Gen. Albert Sidney Johnston was killed at Shiloh and another
wounded in both arms and crippled for life trying to defend his homeland
against an invading army intent on burning, looting, killing and raping. Will
I apologize for them fighting for a cause they thought was right? HELL NO

[BlueStreak]

Whatever, Jack. Try telling the next Black person you meet that slavery wasn't as bad as his ancestors told him it was. Geez.

Dave

[BlueStreak]

Originally Posted by finnbow

Back to the OP. I think the folks that (over)react to what they see as apologies by Obama have largely fallen victim to the "American exceptionalism" argument. Namely, they see America as inherently better than other nations, with loftier ideals, purer motivations, etc. (they relish the shining city on the hill metaphor). This nationalistic poppycock limits their ability to recognize where and when we screw up in international affairs. This myopia also results in the inability to learn valuable lessons from poorly executed international entanglements.

These "apologies" by Obama are nothing more than his acknowledgment of some of these screw-ups to people outside our borders who have long since been keenly aware of them. He's basically showing himself to be realist with some knowledge of history and diplomacy rather than an ideological and antagonistic dolt.

Beautifully put, Finnbow.

This is why I think one of the worst things that came out of WW2 was this absurd notion that if you kick the living piss out of another country, they will become your friends. There are people in this country who honestly buy into this monstrous line of thinking.

Remember GWBs comments on this? "Why, look at Germany and Japan. They were our enemies during the war, and now their our best friends."
I'll bet people all around the globe were thinking; "Man, I wish the Americans would lay waste to my country so we can be friends."

Dave

[Combwork]

[QUOTE=noonereal;13483]
Quote=combwork
If you saw him hurting her again would you haul him off her and when he used foul language and promised to 'get her when your back was turned', maybe lose your temper and hit him?
Quote =noonereal
I sure as hell would.
Quote=combwork
What you say makes sense except for the above; goes in direct contradiction to your original post "God would not be able to help you if you raised a hand to my kids"

The point is noonereal, in some circumstances it's not what you do, it's what people think you would do. The boys parents had to believe I would push a lot harder if I had to. It was a risky strategy; the man was a builder and if push had come to shove, chances are it would have been me who was bounced up and down the playground but like I said, having tried everything else I'd kind of run out of options. I couldn't just ignore it

[Sandy G]

OK, OK, "Hoosain Jug-Ears" & "Alfred E. Neumann" were, perhaps a bit over the top references to The Halfrican, even for a reactionary bastard like me. Do y'all like "Earflaps McSpendy-Pants" any better ? Seems to be a bit more descriptive, anyway... It's also gonna be fun to see what transpires here shortly when the former Guvnor of Illannoys, Rod Blowjobovich, goes on trial, & subpeonas both Barry & his consigliere, Rhambo Emmanuel. HotRod, buddy, I'd watch my backside, if I was you...People have "Met with Accidents" for a helluva lot less....Especially when they've tried to cross some of the Chicago Establishment...Oh, and, y'all here-Lighten Up...This is sposed to be fun...An' pokin' fun at politicos is part of what's so great about Amurrica...