Inside a Bible Belt Classroom

[merrylander]

The "sins of the fathers , , ," is simply a statement of fact, if the father goes whoring around and gets a social disease, then gets his wife pregnant it sure will be visited upon his progeny. The problem is that too damn many people have lost the ability to read and reason. Then they run about saying that it is God's idea for punishment.

[d-ray657]

[QUOTE=Combwork;32844]

Originally Posted by d-ray657

But we accept what we accept from the bible as a matter of faith, not as an historical record.

But when one's acceptance of a particular text from the bible is a result of one's religious faith, it should be recognized as faith and not science.


I'm quoting bits of your post out of context, but as a broad generalisation, that's what Christians do isn't it? In 19th century England, the Victorian 'Hell-Fire' preachers mostly used the Old Testament yet they claimed to be teaching the Christian faith. How can anyone be a Christian and still believe in a jealous God; something that would punish children seven generations down the line for sins commited now? How can anyone believe "an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth" and at the same time, believe "turn the other cheek"? In almost any argument, if someone uses old writings to back up their beliefs, they'll only use the bits that fit in with what they already believe.

Quote Charles.

Jeez, you guys for sure like to work at having fun!!!
Myself, I'm a hedonist, limited only by my economic means. Sitting in a boat, drinking beer, and drowning worms is a most rewarding endeavor. A simple pleasure for a simple mind.

Chas

I'm with you on this one. Like I guess most people in the 1960's I was brought up in a Christian family. I even became a trainee Sunday School teacher but truth be told, this was mainly because I was after the vicker's daughter

See my post 17 above. Unfortunately, many of the things that humans have done in the name of Christianity are shameful. I object to the use of any form of religion as a political tool. I agree with you that many people who consider themselves Christians forget that the New Testament identifies a New Covenant that displaces the law of the Old Testament. One can understand and follow the moral guidance provided by Christ without having to demand that others conform to his beliefs, and certainly without using the power of the government to advance his beliefs.

Regards,

D-Ray

[piece-itpete]

All law is legislated morality. Why is an atheists' belief system more valid than mine?

Pete

[d-ray657]

Originally Posted by piece-itpete

All law is legislated morality. Why is an atheists' belief system more valid than mine?

Pete

How about a set of laws based on the Golden Rule?

Pete, do you believe that the New Covenant replaced the rules set out in the Old Testament?

Regards,

D-Ray

[piece-itpete]

Absolutely. [preacher hat] '"The Lord saw fit to raise us up, out of the morass of mental filth and depravity. He gave himself! (AHMEN!) so that we may more clearly walk in the light of His presence (hear hear). And what did we do, brothers and sisters? What did we do??

We! used the sham of a kangaroo court to kill him (yes we did)(tell it preacher). We beat him, mocked him, whipped him, nailed him up to die of exposure.

And he took it. (ahmen). He took it for us! (AHMEN). Brothers and sisters he DIED! for you and me (tell it brother!). HE DIED! so we can live.

And on that great gittin' up mornin (ahmen!) when his glory is revealed (Ahmen!) His proof will be in our living! (AHMEN!) (YEAH!) (church breaks into song: 'oh my Lord, Lord Lord Lord.....')

[/preacher hat]

Seriously, you haven't had any church up in heah till you've been to a black gospel church. And some of the nicest people I've ever met.

He did say no more eye for an eye. He did say love your neighbor, and in this way you will be fulfilling the Law.

He also said we would be brother against brother, and father against son, and "Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword."

Or perhaps the parable of the tenants. God does not fit into our molds or passing morals but does as He sees fit. Of course. He's the man with a plan

Pete

[BlueStreak]

Except that some of us tend to believe that man created "God" as a tool to serve his own purposes and ambitions, at least as far as the construct of organized religions are concerned. I ask; Is it not possible to believe in a superior being, God if you will, but not subscribe to any of the established organized religions?

I believe so. What say you?

Dave

[Zeke]

Originally Posted by BlueStreak

I ask; Is it not possible to believe in a superior being, God if you will, but not subscribe to any of the established organized religions?

That's called, "being an American Indian."

Of course, we have our own bastardized stuff, too... That whole Native American Church thing is a relatively recent adaptation, as was the Ghost Dance, at least when compared to the Big Three religions, worldwide.

[Combwork]

See my post 17 above. Unfortunately, many of the things that humans have done in the name of Christianity are shameful. I object to the use of any form of religion as a political tool. I agree with you that many people who consider themselves Christians forget that the New Testament identifies a New Covenant that displaces the law of the Old Testament. One can understand and follow the moral guidance provided by Christ without having to demand that others conform to his beliefs, and certainly without using the power of the government to advance his beliefs.

Regards,

D-Ray.

Ok, selective quotes at the ready.

"However, for those who don't see the bible as a history book, but as a collection of moral and spiritual principles, communicated through the perspective of ancient writers, it takes on a different kind of truth".


This is another stumbling block; how can truth be of a different kind? "The things that you're liable to read in the Bible, they ain't necessarily so" (SING)


"Do unto others as you would have them do unto you."

Or to put it in a way that most people find easier to understand, "Do as you would be done by". I think this is from The Water Babies by the Reverend Charles Kingsley. A very forward thinking man, he saw the immorality of high Victorian society. Instead of tackling it head on he came in from the side and wrote this wonderful book.

"The Golden Rule."

Isn't this connected with the Freemasons? A group that at times were at war with the Christian church and at best have an uneasy peace? I'm not a Freemason but a good friend of mine is. The only thing he's really told me about the Masons is to join, you have to believe in purpose, believe in order. Above all, you have to have spiritual belief, but not necessarily Christian belief.

Something that's always puzzled me about Christians. Why do they fight each other so much? In Scotland we've got the Church of Scotland, the Free Church (Presbyterian I think), and a group disparagingly known as the "Wee Free's". This last lot are real hard core; make Jehovah's Witnesses seem like a fun loving bunch. Go down to England and as well as the Church of England, we've got Congregationalists, Baptists, the "Church of the peculiar people" (this isn't a piss take, it's real, or at least was).

Then the real divide, Protestants and Catholics. All these groups, all from a common root, and they've all got one thing in common. Deep down, every damn one of them hate each other and think the world would be a better place if they weren't in it. [/QUOTE]
123456

[piece-itpete]

Anyone is free to believe anything they want

Comb, I don't hate Catholics. But those Methodists on the other hand ....

Pete

[Combwork]

Originally Posted by piece-itpete

Anyone is free to believe anything they want

Comb, I don't hate Catholics. But those Methodists on the other hand ....

Pete

Fair enough my friend. But you're a free thinker. Compared to society as it was, Christians were free thinkers. Prostitutes, Lepers, those of a lower Caste; all welcome, all treated the same.