Supply-Side Economics

[whell]

Originally Posted by donquixote99

Otherwise he would not speak of nations and regions 'clobbering us' on trade. He's thinks we lose money if we run a 'trade deficit' with someone, which is just silly.

We don't necessarily "loose money". What we do have is increased debt when an economy imports more than it exports. It also causes over time a loss of jobs, an off-shoring of the expertise necessary to make some products and a reduction in the standard of living. Sound familiar?

Instead of just accepting something and calling it "the new normal", it makes sense to try and address it / improve it.

[donquixote99]

Originally Posted by whell

We don't necessarily "loose money". What we do have is increased debt when an economy imports more than it exports. It also causes over time a loss of jobs, an off-shoring of the expertise necessary to make some products and a reduction in the standard of living. Sound familiar?

Instead of just accepting something and calling it "the new normal", it makes sense to try and address it / improve it.

The point isn't the economics, which includes good effects as well, and may or may not involve increased debt. The point is what Trump believes, and he believes trade is a zero-sum conflict, and you're LOSING if you have a deficit.

[whell]

Originally Posted by donquixote99

The point isn't the economics, which includes good effects as well, and may or may not involve increased debt. The point is what Trump believes, and he believes trade is a zero-sum conflict, and you're LOSING if you have a deficit.

Can you post evidence that he's stated this?

I think that issue is something quite different. We're in a global economy now. The US net trade balance is actually looking pretty decent over the last couple month but historically it's concerning:

https://tradingeconomics.com/united-...lance-of-trade

An economy with less outflows of goods and services versus inflows is not, all by itself, necessarily a bad thing. But it can have a corrosive effect on the types of jobs available, and how much those jobs are worth in the economy. And that's what Trump, from my view, keeps coming back to in the argument about trade imbalances.

https://www.theatlantic.com/business...eficit/509912/

Trade deficits, even in times of strong growth, have negative, concentrated impacts on the quantity and quality of jobs in parts of the country where manufacturing employment diminishes. Even the economists who argue (incorrectly, we believe) that the trade deficit doesn’t affect the total number of jobs do admit that it affects the composition of jobs. There is, for example, a lot of research confirming that deindustrialization in the Rust Belt is partly a result of the fact that America meets its domestic demand for manufactured goods by importing more than it exports. One oft-cited academic study found that imbalanced trade with China led to the loss of more than 2 million U.S. jobs between 1991 and 2011, about half of which were in manufacturing (which worked out to 17 percent of manufacturing jobs overall during that time).* Further, the economist Josh Bivens found that in 2011 the cost of imbalanced trade with low-wage countries cost workers without college degrees 5.5 percent of their annual earnings (about $1,800). Far from a small, isolated group, these workers represent two-thirds of the American workforce.

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by whell

Can you post evidence that he's stated this?

His zero-sum view of trade is one of his few consistent (and consistently wrong) positions.

https://www.quora.com/Is-Trump-right...-zero-sum-game

http://fortune.com/2017/01/23/trump-...ress-zero-sum/

https://www.dartmouth.edu/~rstaiger/...p_June2017.pdf

https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-ris...ics-1469033016

[whell]

Originally Posted by finnbow

His zero-sum view of trade is one of his few consistent (and consistently wrong) positions.

https://www.quora.com/Is-Trump-right...-zero-sum-game

http://fortune.com/2017/01/23/trump-...ress-zero-sum/

https://www.dartmouth.edu/~rstaiger/...p_June2017.pdf

https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-ris...ics-1469033016

These are opinion pieces where his remarks or "intent" is interpreted or projected. They're not quotes of Trump stating that he believes international trade is a "zero sum" game or conflict.

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by whell

These are opinion pieces where his remarks or "intent" is interpreted or projected. They're not quotes of Trump stating that he believes international trade is a "zero sum" game or conflict.

Bullshit. Everything to him is a zero sum game, whereby the world is comprised of those who praise Trump and losers, particularly for trade. Just because Trump doesn't say "trade is a zero-sum game" in those exact words doesn't mean that his policy isn't such, just as him not saying "I am a racist" doesn't mean he is not a racist. Even in Pompeo's Senate testimony, he said that what Trump says doesn't matter, only his policies matter and the links I provide above clearly demonstrate his beliefs/policy result from zero-sum game thinking.

You really should refrain from posting about economics - you know as little about it as your Dear Leader knows about basic human decency.

[whell]

Originally Posted by finnbow

Bullshit. Everything to him is a zero sum game, whereby the world is comprised of those who praise Trump and losers, particularly for trade. Just because Trump doesn't say "trade is a zero-sum game" in those exact words doesn't mean that his policy isn't such, just as him not saying "I am a racist" doesn't mean he is not a racist.

Just because he doesn't say it doesn't stop you from applying it.

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by whell

We don't necessarily "loose money". What we do have is increased debt when an economy imports more than it exports. It also causes over time a loss of jobs, an off-shoring of the expertise necessary to make some products and a reduction in the standard of living. Sound familiar?

Instead of just accepting something and calling it "the new normal", it makes sense to try and address it / improve it.

You, like your idiotic Dear Leader, don't know the difference between a trade deficit and a budget deficit. Every post you make on matters economic should how little you truly understand it.

[whell]

Originally Posted by finnbow

You, like your idiotic Dear Leader, don't know the difference between a trade deficit and a budget deficit. Every post you make on matters economic should how little you truly understand it.

You're full of shit, Finn. I posted about a trade deficit, which can have exactly the corrosive effects that I discussed. I'm not sure how you found a reference to a budget deficit with my comments about a loss of skills necessary to make some products???

I think we're back to wondering about your ability to comprehend what is posted.

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by whell

You're full of shit, Finn. I posted about a trade deficit, which can have exactly the corrosive effects that I discussed. I'm not sure how you found a reference to a budget deficit with my comments about a loss of skills necessary to make some products???

I think we're back to wondering about your ability to comprehend what is posted.

You posted "What we do have is increased debt when an economy imports more than it exports" as if there is a clear and demonstrable relationship between the budget deficits and trade deficit. There isn't.