How about some benzene in your water? Yellowstone river gets Keystoned.

[merrylander]

Originally Posted by piece-itpete

Apparently energy independence has a cost.

Between 'benzene' and 'tar oil' I think Lehrer could write a pretty biting song.

Pete

Unfortunately 'tis you and I that will pay that cost not the oil companies.

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by piece-itpete

Apparently energy independence has a cost.

Between 'benzene' and 'tar oil' I think Lehrer could write a pretty biting song.

Pete

What's funny is that environmentalists think we can get adequate energy without oil, gas, coal, nuclear, hydropower (if fish spawn there), and wind and solar farms (if they're located within view of their backyards).

It reminds of a joke made about Germany's Green Party back when I lived there. Roughly translated "Greens believe that they get their power directly from their electrical outlets (that their power is manufactured within their clean, environmentally friendly outlets without the need to be connected to the dirty power grid).

[bobabode]

Originally Posted by finnbow

What's funny is that environmentalists think we can get adequate energy without oil, gas, coal, nuclear, hydropower (if fish spawn there), and wind and solar farms (if they're located within view of their backyards).

It reminds of a joke made about Germany's Green Party back when I lived there. Roughly translated "Greens believe that they get their power directly from their electrical outlets (that their power is manufactured within their clean, environmentally friendly outlets without the need to be connected to the dirty power grid).

Nice strawman you've built there.

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by bobabode

Nice strawman you've built there.

I happen to have a greater confidence in science and technology than I do in whiny environmentalists fulling understanding and weighing the available options commensurate with our energy needs. YMMV.

The whole Keystone pipeline debate has become an article of faith for both sides, neither of which are correct IMO. It will neither destroy the earth and the aquifer, nor will it solve our employment problems. It has simply a symbolic issue for both sides to champion.

[bobabode]

Originally Posted by finnbow

I happy to have a greater confidence in science and technology than I do in whiny environmentalists fulling understanding and weighing the available options commensurate with our energy needs. YMMV.

The whole Keystone pipeline debate has become an article of faith for both sides, neither of which are correct IMO. It will neither destroy the earth and the aquifer, nor will it solve our employment problems. It has simply a symbolic issue for both sides to champion.

Gotta love how the proponents of Keystone have flip flopped on eminent domain as a conservative article of faith.

Without straw, adobe bricks suck...

[nailer]

Originally Posted by finnbow

I happen to have a greater confidence in science and technology than I do in whiny environmentalists fulling understanding and weighing the available options commensurate with our energy needs. YMMV.

The whole Keystone pipeline debate has become an article of faith for both sides, neither of which are correct IMO. It will neither destroy the earth and the aquifer, nor will it solve our employment problems. It has simply a symbolic issue for both sides to champion.

We'd be using far less fossil fuel to generate electricity today if TMI hadn't been used to further a cause. We humans tend to go ape all too often.

[piece-itpete]

It's crazy. And even if we could fart cheap effective solar panels civilization would still be dirty from earth's POV.

Pete

[bobabode]

Originally Posted by piece-itpete

It's crazy. And even if we could fart cheap effective solar panels civilization would still be dirty from earth's POV.

Pete

Right. So your solution is that we should do nothing...got it.

[bobabode]

There's sand in this 'tar sands' gunk, right? Anyone care to hazard a guess what the scouring rate is within these pipelines?

[CarlV]

I will freely admit I think it is wrong, wrong, wrong to give big oil a free ride, besides the tax credits to billionaires, with no accountability for failures in the pipeline. Or to replace it when it's lifetime is up, usually 40 years.
I don't really care if the Republicans call it the Keystone Jobs Bill, they are not ever be honest as long as they are owned by the Koch Brothers anyway. Yessir, those 35-40 permanent jobs will really save the day here lol. Oh I forgot, it is the 2500 temporary jobs that will do it.......

Bottom line, if they build the pipeline they should own all that goes with responsible ownership.


Carl