ObamaCare and Bankruptcy

[Chicks]

Originally Posted by whell

a NY Times piece which pretty thoroughly puts the lie to CR's little graph.

Wait, don't you mean the "failing NY Times"? And aren't they Fake News? Why would you use them to prove a point?

BTW, did anyone else notice Trump continues to give interviews to the "fake news" outlets, all the while bashing them at rallies for his idiot supporters?

NYT stock price jumped 12% on great earnings today. Hell of a way to fail!

[merrylander]

Originally Posted by whell

I don't dispute their math. I did dispute their premise and their methodology.

I think the BS factor in the CR image you provided has been pretty thoroughly exposed here. I've explained it quite clearly, and even countered CR's "counting exercise" links to research and a NY Times piece which pretty thoroughly puts the lie to CR's little graph.

But hey, Bob, don't let me stand in your way if you want to stand by the BS.

You do realize that bankruptcies due to medical expenses are unheard of in most civilized countries.

[whell]

Also, here's a tidbit from the NY Times from a year and a half ago, which was two years after the implementation of the shared responsibility provisions of the ACA.

The number of uninsured Americans has fallen by an estimated 15 million since 2013, thanks largely to the Affordable Care Act. But a new survey, the first detailed study of Americans struggling with medical bills, shows that insurance often fails as a safety net. Health plans often require hundreds or thousands of dollars in out-of-pocket payments — sums that can create a cascade of financial troubles for the many households living paycheck to paycheck.

...and this:

In the new poll, conducted by The New York Times and the Kaiser Family Foundation, roughly 20 percent of people under age 65 with health insurance nonetheless reported having problems paying their medical bills over the last year. By comparison, 53 percent of people without insurance said the same.

...and finally this:

These financial vulnerabilities reflect the high costs of health care in the United States, the most expensive place in the world to get sick. They also highlight a substantial shift in the nature of health insurance. Since the late 1990s, insurance plans have begun asking their customers to pay an increasingly greater share of their bills out of pocket though rising deductibles and co-payments. The Affordable Care Act, signed by President Obama in 2010, protected many Americans from very high health costs by requiring insurance plans to be more comprehensive, but at the same time it allowed or even encouraged increases in deductibles.

Now, none of this is particularly great news. But it does underscore the "BS factor" of CR posting a graph attempting to support the idea that Obamacare has somehow fixed the underlying issue with the US health care system, which is COST OF CARE not lack of coverage.

[Pio1980]

Doing a topical websearch;

https://www.theatlantic.com/health/a...l-debt/381163/

http://amjmed.org/under-aca-medical-...tcy-continues/

http://www.snopes.com/643000-bankrup...medical-bills/

[MrPots]

The flaw with that comment Merrylander is the United States is not a civilized country by any means.

You're comparing apples to oranges.

[Rajoo]

Originally Posted by MrPots

The flaw with that comment Merrylander is the United States is not a civilized country by any means.

You're comparing apples to oranges.

I think it's the system. Most gainfully employed people, those working for unions and most importantly government employees at every level are provided healthcare by their employers as a no-tax benefit.

So people having to buy healthcare (or go without one) are in the minority. Besides the people in Congress are not facing this situation since they get very generous health benefits, more like give themselves what they want.

[MrPots]

Originally Posted by Rajoo

I think it's the system. Most gainfully employed people, those working for unions and most importantly government employees at every level are provided healthcare by their employers as a no-tax benefit.

So people having to buy healthcare (or go without one) are in the minority. Besides the people in Congress are not facing this situation since they get very generous health benefits, more like give themselves what they want.

The point is, we're not a civilized country. We have a predatory health care system that preys on the sick for obscene profits, a predatory educational system designed to put students in lifetime debt, indeed our entire capitalist system which is supposed to "foster competition" only destroys competition; you can drive across this nation and find the same exact hand full of chain stores and restaurants with the same exact products in every city nationwide.... and not much else, we murder each other by the tens of thousands every year, black people are on police hit lists across the country, we treat hispanics like lepers and Muslims even worse, our political system is corrupt as the day is long and we don't seem to give a fuck, we're greedy beyond comprehension, and we're as hateful and ugly as a nation gets.

And that's not even touching our history of genocide and slavery.

We are not a civilized nation.

[whell]

Originally Posted by MrPots

The point is, we're not a civilized country. We have a predatory health care system that preys on the sick for obscene profits, a predatory educational system designed to put students in lifetime debt, indeed our entire capitalist system which is supposed to "foster competition" only destroys competition; you can drive across this nation and find the same exact hand full of chain stores and restaurants with the same exact products in every city nationwide.... and not much else, we murder each other by the tens of thousands every year, black people are on police hit lists across the country, we treat hispanics like lepers and Muslims even worse, our political system is corrupt as the day is long and we don't seem to give a fuck, we're greedy beyond comprehension, and we're as hateful and ugly as a nation gets.

And that's not even touching our history of genocide and slavery.

We are not a civilized nation.

You didn't take your meds this week?

[MrPots]

Originally Posted by whell

You didn't take your meds this week?

You can pretend this isn't what our country is if you want. Lot's of people refuse to face it. Lots of people live in their own fantasy world we're we're number one YAY! Go ahead, get your confederate flag and fly it off the back of your truck if it makes you feel more manly...more patriotic.

If you'd open your eyes you'd see exactly where this country is goose marching towards.

[donquixote99]

Originally Posted by whell

You didn't take your meds this week?

Dondillion will be so glad to see this latest effort at sharing information.