Another Mass Shooting in the Good Ol' USA

[Ike Bana]

Originally Posted by BigElCat

Now they're saying it was 80 minutes.

Police threw up a perimeter to deal with unruly parents (desperate to save their kids) while they rehashed state vs federal authority.

So...the first time I experienced this was back around 1990, I was out and decided to pick up a cup of coffee at 7-11. There's this patrol car sitting in the parking lot, windows down, cops there in the car. I figured it was a donut break. So as I'm heading toward the door the driver says something like, "You might not want to go in there." So I ask if there's a problem and I'm told that the store alarm went off. They obviously were not going in there. A few years later I'm on my way into a Target store, there's a cop at the door, tells me there's a possible incident, man with a gun inside. But none of the cops are going inside. About 10 years ago the silent alarm went off at the counseling agency where I worked. Nobody knew it had been set off, but there's a patrol car sitting at the curb in front of the office. So...the office manager asks me to go out there and check what's happening. The cop says..."Your alarm went off." So I innocently say, "Oh, OK, it's just that you've been out here for a while and we didn't know what it was about." The cop is annoyed with my comment and says, "We don't know what's going on in there, we're not going in there."

Well these 90 Texas cops hanging out in the hallway on the other side of the door of a fourth grade classroom for an hour knew exactly what was going on in there. They could hear the automatic weapons fire.



https://youtu.be/jiZZ0IJL2_w

[Chicks]

Canada's government moves to make selling or importing handguns illegal

https://www.npr.org/2022/05/30/11020...-sales-imports

A civilized country.

[piece-itpete]

Originally Posted by RickeyM

A ban on gun ownership by civilians.

Well you asked.

Originally Posted by Ike Bana

....
But the discussion of comparative firearms homicide rates, has always been amongst first world countries...y'know countries like the United States, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Japan, the UK, France, Germany, Switzerland, and the Scandinavian countries to name a few. Democracies...not dictatorships.
......

Originally Posted by finnbow

Since you've chosen to get so specific:
1. Raise purchase age to 21 (he was 18 as was the kid in Buffalo).
2. Red flag law (he showed self-destructive and violent signs like self-mutilation).
3. Forbid autoloading firearms and limit magazine capacity to 5 rounds (federal law already restricts magazine capacity to 3 rounds to hunt migratory game birds (ducks, geese, doves and they're harder to hit than humans)).
4. In keeping with strict conservative constitutional originalism, restrict unlimited firearms access to flintlocks only (I'm joking here, but conservatives always insist adamantly upon originalism).

Sorry if it seems I just do drive-by posts. My life is just so busy.

I do appreciate the candor guys. I will return the courtesy. It mostly says, the guns rights folks are right about gun regulations being a slippery slope to a ban.

Ike I get the European thing. They are very different though, mostly much smaller, more like our states. Also, I don't have the time to research, but a few years ago I did, and if you take out suicides the numbers are much, much closer per capita. Take out our very bad neighborhoods and your chances of being shot in the US is very very low.

I looked online - according to Pew, gun deaths in the us were at 47,xxx near the end of Dec 2021, 54% due to suicide. By comparison car crash deaths in 2021 were 42,xxx.

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tan...hs-in-the-u-s/

Finn I doubt our august Founders would've wanted our minutemen to have outdated weapons! The 18 to 21 thing, maybe it's time to consider raising the age of self determination to 21. It might hurt the military though.

Originally Posted by Pio1980

It can be logically argued that the original intent of the second amendment was defense and preservation of slavery and white supremacy, as a sop to get Southern states to sign .....

Pio that's a real stretch. I'm thinking we need to teach more history in school.

Background: I 'accidentally' own 3 guns (inherited)(22 revolver, little 28 auto and a 38 auto) and am considering 3 more (45 1911, pump shotgun and AR15, with the AR currently unlikely). Since Ohio passed their new no-permit needed CC law I've been considering putting the little 28 in my drivers door pocket (hidden of course) - I do go into some very bad neighborhoods for work. I will never register these guns.

For the record I grew up learning gun safety, thanks Dad. Considering the reality of the vast number of guns in the US I rec this to everyone, heck the basics should be taught in school, young.

I've got to ask - if ANY of you had a gun, and the opportunity, wouldn't you have tried taking the shooter out? Assuming you had a clear shot.

***

Since it's been brought up in this thread, I'm a conservative. Shocking I know I couldn't bring myself to vote for the arrogant jackass or the arrogant witch so I did something new - I tossed my vote to a write in. 'Why Not Zoidberg' for Pres and 'Bender B. Rodriguez' for VP.

This just in- they didn't win. Heck they were both foreign nationals. How low we have fallen.

[Oerets]

I was raised with the use of a firearm as a tool. Never was a hunter or fisherman for that matter. Lived on a farm with hogs chickens Geese herford's even rabbits. Horses there to ride.

So learned to use a .22 and 12 gauge single shot, and a 30.06 from my grandfather on varmints. Not the same for the new shooters I have run across. They have learned from movies videos and playing games.

Doubt that a majority of the new shooters in all reality know true gun safety.
Or even care.


I see at the range a ever increasing showing of a force at the range shooting and they scare the .... out of me. Haven't got a pass for the range this year because of the couple of times, a close call almost ended badly last year. Not in the mood, may also be because our state also got rid of the CC permit and now has enacted "constitutional carry".

The newer gun owners I venture half just fire down range as fast as possible. Not aiming unless it is at full 2 liter pop bottles. Or other type of exploding targets....


These are the ones who are misguided into thinking a AR will stop a takeover of our country.

[Chicks]

WASHINGTON (The Borowitz Report)—In a chorus of derision, leading Republicans ripped the Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau’s proposed freeze on handgun sales as an “insane” and “illogical” response to gun violence.

“With all due respect, Prime Minister Trudeau’s so-called solution to gun violence is misguided, at best,” Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell said. “There is no verifiable link between guns and shooting.”

The governor of Texas, Greg Abbott, shared McConnell’s view. “Canada’s solution to gun violence ignores the fact that people who shoot people inside buildings first have to enter those buildings,” he said. “The problem isn’t guns—it’s doors.”

Senator Ted Cruz, also of Texas, could barely contain his contempt for Trudeau’s plan. “So Trudeau thinks that you can reduce gun violence by reducing the number of guns?” Cruz said. “Earth to Justin!”

[donquixote99]

Suicides count. A bout of depression is seldom fatal, unless there's a gun in the house.

[BigElCat]

Originally Posted by piece-itpete

Sorry if it seems I just do drive-by posts. My life is just so busy.

I do appreciate the candor guys. I will return the courtesy. It mostly says, the guns rights folks are right about gun regulations being a slippery slope to a ban.

Ike I get the European thing. They are very different though, mostly much smaller, more like our states. Also, I don't have the time to research, but a few years ago I did, and if you take out suicides the numbers are much, much closer per capita. Take out our very bad neighborhoods and your chances of being shot in the US is very very low.

I looked online - according to Pew, gun deaths in the us were at 47,xxx near the end of Dec 2021, 54% due to suicide. By comparison car crash deaths in 2021 were 42,xxx.

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tan...hs-in-the-u-s/

Finn I doubt our august Founders would've wanted our minutemen to have outdated weapons! The 18 to 21 thing, maybe it's time to consider raising the age of self determination to 21. It might hurt the military though.



Pio that's a real stretch. I'm thinking we need to teach more history in school.

Background: I 'accidentally' own 3 guns (inherited)(22 revolver, little 28 auto and a 38 auto) and am considering 3 more (45 1911, pump shotgun and AR15, with the AR currently unlikely). Since Ohio passed their new no-permit needed CC law I've been considering putting the little 28 in my drivers door pocket (hidden of course) - I do go into some very bad neighborhoods for work. I will never register these guns.

For the record I grew up learning gun safety, thanks Dad. Considering the reality of the vast number of guns in the US I rec this to everyone, heck the basics should be taught in school, young.

I've got to ask - if ANY of you had a gun, and the opportunity, wouldn't you have tried taking the shooter out? Assuming you had a clear shot.

***

Since it's been brought up in this thread, I'm a conservative. Shocking I know I couldn't bring myself to vote for the arrogant jackass or the arrogant witch so I did something new - I tossed my vote to a write in. 'Why Not Zoidberg' for Pres and 'Bender B. Rodriguez' for VP.

This just in- they didn't win. Heck they were both foreign nationals. How low we have fallen.

mmm hmm

don't invest in any guns. Your 38 auto is superior to a 1911. Slip me a shipping address, I'll send you 50 rounds to practice with.

[Pio1980]

A goodly number of kids my age, well-before, and after, were indoctrinated with the self-serving "Lost Cause "rationalization for the Southern rebellion. Folks knew "states rights" was a thin cover for Christian white supremacy. Learning the difference between facts and fiction is part of an educated growth. "Way of life" is still a synonym for Christian white supremacy down hereabouts, the politics rotate around it as powerfully now without enforced segregation as it did when it was. It is extant in other regions as well. It seems to focus on unrestricted second amendment "rights" as the political expression to defend them, and it.
Whatever the FFs intended with the Minuitman concept, successful National defense hasn't been based on unordered random collectives of nonuniformed randomly armed volunteers for a couple centuries.

[BigElCat]

Originally Posted by Ike Bana

So...the first time I experienced this was back around 1990, I was out and decided to pick up a cup of coffee at 7-11. There's this patrol car sitting in the parking lot, windows down, cops there in the car. I figured it was a donut break. So as I'm heading toward the door the driver says something like, "You might not want to go in there." So I ask if there's a problem and I'm told that the store alarm went off. They obviously were not going in there. A few years later I'm on my way into a Target store, there's a cop at the door, tells me there's a possible incident, man with a gun inside. But none of the cops are going inside. About 10 years ago the silent alarm went off at the counseling agency where I worked. Nobody knew it had been set off, but there's a patrol car sitting at the curb in front of the office. So...the office manager asks me to go out there and check what's happening. The cop says..."Your alarm went off." So I innocently say, "Oh, OK, it's just that you've been out here for a while and we didn't know what it was about." The cop is annoyed with my comment and says, "We don't know what's going on in there, we're not going in there."

Well these 90 Texas cops hanging out in the hallway on the other side of the door of a fourth grade classroom for an hour knew exactly what was going on in there. They could hear the automatic weapons fire.



https://youtu.be/jiZZ0IJL2_w

Some times they do, bro. Doug Schroeder, a small town police chief knew this perp personally. Knew he was shooting everybody in sight with an AK-47. Ran him down and shot him dead (IIRC with a pump shotgun, or maybe an AR rifle).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hesston_shooting

[BigElCat]

PIO is correct; James Madison, a slave owner, wrote the second amendment to oppose the federal government on the issue of slavery. "Freedom" meant the right to own slaves.

https://www.britannica.com/topic/Second-Amendment