How wealth relates.....

Kamakiri · #1 11-05-2010, 11:41 AM

I think that's what draws people away from organized religion in the first place....the perception of hypocrisy.

But honestly I think that most minds get it totally wrong. The Earth and everything on it was put here for people to enjoy. Sure, excesses financially would be wrong while our brethren go without, but I do not believe that a religious figure has to live in abject poverty for their words to hold currency.

I think to get to the root of faith, you have to give more regard to the message than the messenger. Contributions to any ministry are by choice.

Do you know what kind of people give to televangelism? I do, I volunteered to work the phones for a TCT Praise-A-Thon back in the spring, as an outreach project with my Church. It's not the blue haired spinster who is giving away her fortune to God while she holds a pomeranian on her lap. It's the unemployed, it's the retiree struggling to live, it's the person on their last dime and can barely afford food. I swear that as the people gave me their credit card information, that I wanted to transpose a digit just so that they wouldn't end up doing it. I prayed with these people, and the experience was very moving, one that I will never forget.

And I will say, the last thing that I will say about these people is that they were fools. That night, I saw pure faith in Christ.....which glaringly pointed out severe gaps in my own. I left after my shift, much different than when I started.

One can ruminate over whether that poor man's money went to golden cufflinks or a bottle of Dom Perrignon for a slick haired preacher, but the people that called were the true believers. If the preacher goes on a bender, I think he'll get it worse from the man upstairs than any of us ever could.

BlueStreak · #2 11-05-2010, 12:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamakiri

Contributions to any ministry are by choice.

Ummmmmm--Faith Based Initiative?

Do you know what kind of people give to televangelism? I do, I volunteered to work the phones for a TCT Praise-A-Thon back in the spring, as an outreach project with my Church. It's not the blue haired spinster who is giving away her fortune to God while she holds a pomeranian on her lap. It's the unemployed, it's the retiree struggling to live, it's the person on their last dime and can barely afford food. I swear that as the people gave me their credit card information, that I wanted to transpose a digit just so that they wouldn't end up doing it. I prayed with these people, and the experience was very moving, one that I will never forget.

And I will say, the last thing that I will say about these people is that they were fools. That night, I saw pure faith in Christ.....which glaringly pointed out severe gaps in my own. I left after my shift, much different than when I started.

One can ruminate over whether that poor man's money went to golden cufflinks or a bottle of Dom Perrignon for a slick haired preacher, but the people that called were the true believers. If the preacher goes on a bender, I think he'll get it worse from the man upstairs than any of us ever could.

I agree, completely. Once my parents reached their eighies, they began being hounded by evangelist organizations seeking donations.Some of them making the most outrageous claims.

I agree that the people donating truly believe they are doing good. But, I also believe they are largely being exploited by wolves. This is one reason why I say I have faith in God and hope for an afterlife, but place little to no faith in organized religion. One is a spiritual hunger, the other is a business contrived by men.

Perhaps you don't agree. But can you at least see my point?

Dave

Kamakiri · #3 11-05-2010, 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueStreak

Perhaps you don't agree. But can you at least see my point?

Dave

Totally see your point. In fact, it's only because the Church that I go to, wanted to pick me up at the lowest point in my life and has never asked for once cent in return that led me to be an active member there. Other denominations could learn a lot from them.

Grumpy · #4 11-05-2010, 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamakiri

Totally see your point. In fact, it's only because the Church that I go to, wanted to pick me up at the lowest point in my life and has never asked for once cent in return that led me to be an active member there. Other denominations could learn a lot from them.

You are a very lucky person to find a house of worship like that.

My experience with the catholic church does not even come close to that. They not only wanted 25% of my ex wife and I income, they also wanted our children's souls, so badly in fact that they made me sign papers that my children would not be raised in my own faith.

BlueStreak · #5 11-05-2010, 11:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grumpy

You are a very lucky person to find a house of worship like that.

My experience with the catholic church does not even come close to that. They not only wanted 25% of my ex wife and I income, they also wanted our children's souls, so badly in fact that they made me sign papers that my children would not be raised in my own faith.

Now that is truly sickening. I would have told them where to shove those papers. But, then, I'm not known for my restraint and subtlety.

Bill Maher had a similar story. His mother was Jewish and his father Catholic.
He said he grew up horrified by the way the church and other Catholics treated his father, who remained a devoted Catholic despite the abuse, and literally demanded his mother renounce her faith. He said he would never forgive them for that.

Dave

merrylander · #6 11-06-2010, 07:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grumpy

You are a very lucky person to find a house of worship like that.

My experience with the catholic church does not even come close to that. They not only wanted 25% of my ex wife and I income, they also wanted our children's souls, so badly in fact that they made me sign papers that my children would not be raised in my own faith.

That was the case with my brother as well, but Quebec had always been priest ridden.

Kamakiri · #7 11-09-2010, 08:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grumpy

You are a very lucky person to find a house of worship like that.

I do feel very fortunate. In fact, my official water baptism is this Sunday.

I sat down with one of the pastors about a year ago, who took me out to dinner. He said that churches make the mistake of subscribing to the theory of "more noses more nickels", which has never been the calling of my Church. The mission statement of my Church is "One people one call.....to heal the broken". I am happy to count myself among them.

Grumpy · #8 11-09-2010, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamakiri

I do feel very fortunate. In fact, my official water baptism is this Sunday.

I sat down with one of the pastors about a year ago, who took me out to dinner. He said that churches make the mistake of subscribing to the theory of "more noses more nickels", which has never been the calling of my Church. The mission statement of my Church is "One people one call.....to heal the broken". I am happy to count myself among them.

If there were more houses like this, the world would be a much better place !

merrylander · #9 11-09-2010, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grumpy

If there were more houses like this, the world would be a much better place !

Indeed, sadly there is too much at stake in the business of religion and too many layabouts with their sinecure at stake.

BlueStreak · #10 11-05-2010, 11:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamakiri

Totally see your point. In fact, it's only because the Church that I go to, wanted to pick me up at the lowest point in my life and has never asked for once cent in return that led me to be an active member there. Other denominations could learn a lot from them.

Right on.

Dave