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06-30-2012, 10:36 PM
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Area Man
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Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: The Swamp
Posts: 27,407
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Stolen Valor Act Decision
This decision was also handed down on the same day that Conservative Cheif Justice Roberts sided with Liberals on the PPACA decision.
http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/lo...160717915.html
A 6-3 decision in favor of protecting compulsive liar Alvarez's 1st Amendment Rights. This coupled with the fact that the Obama Administration sought to uphold the "Stolen Valor" law must make Thursday a very confusing day for you wingnuts.
So, what say you?
(This is gonna be fun. )
Dave
__________________
"When the lie is so big and the fog so thick, the Republican trick can play out again....."-------Frank Zappa
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07-01-2012, 12:05 AM
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: San Diego California
Posts: 3,261
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueStreak
This decision was also handed down on the same day that Conservative Cheif Justice Roberts sided with Liberals on the PPACA decision.
http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/lo...160717915.html
A 6-3 decision in favor of protecting compulsive liar Alvarez's 1st Amendment Rights. This coupled with the fact that the Obama Administration sought to uphold the "Stolen Valor" law must make Thursday a very confusing day for you wingnuts.
So, what say you?
(This is gonna be fun. )
Dave
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I side with the court's decision. The government ought not be used to bridle someone's speech even if the speech is distasteful. I'm generally against both sides when it comes to the addition of new laws and regulations. Interestingly, the Stolen Valor Act was introduced both in the the House and the Senate by democrats.
__________________
Dear Optimist: Unless life gives you water and sugar too, your lemonade will suck.
Last edited by bhunter; 07-01-2012 at 12:09 AM.
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07-01-2012, 12:45 AM
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Loyal Opposition
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Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Johnson County, Kansas
Posts: 14,401
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Kennedy made a good point that punishing a simple falsehood sets a dangerous precedent. The Court suggested that publishing a falsehood with the intent that someone rely on it could be punished, if the statute was narrowly drawn to directly address the harm. That is pretty close to the point at which the falsehood ceases to be a victimless crime. I would limit the coverage of any criminal sanction for such communication to where there is an intent that someone rely on the false statements, there is actual reliance on the false statement, and such reliance causes actual harm. The harm should be real, like financial loss, but not just offended sensibilities.
Regards,
D-Ray
__________________
Then I'll get on my knees and pray,
We won't get fooled again; Don't get fooled again
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07-01-2012, 02:01 AM
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Area Man
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Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: The Swamp
Posts: 27,407
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A couple weeks ago, I went to Colonial Williamsburg.
They had a little play on Duke of Gloucester Street set up to demonstrate this very thing.
A group of soldiers had overheard a man expressing loyalty to the British Crown and calling the American troops "fools". They assembled a kangaroo court, declared him guilty of "seditious speech" and set about to tar and feather him. One of the Burgesses discovered what was going on and put a stop to it, ordered them to let the man go.
Why?
"Expressing an opinion, even a distasteful one, is not a crime. Every man has a right to speak his mind."
You would be amazed the people I heard bitching as they walked away from that play.....who did not get it....AT ALL. A man standing behind me mumbled, "You can't even escape the liberal bullshit in Williamsburg."
Just thought I'd share that.
Dave
__________________
"When the lie is so big and the fog so thick, the Republican trick can play out again....."-------Frank Zappa
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07-01-2012, 02:14 AM
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Area Man
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Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: The Swamp
Posts: 27,407
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Oh, and BTW. I got this article from my Navy squadrons FaceBook page. They were, figuratively speaking, tarring and feathering Mr. Alvarez and blaming the Democratic Party for the entire incident.
Until I pointed out that the "Stolen Valor" legislation was introduced by Democrats, the Obama administration had advocated upholding the law in this case and that two of the conservative justices had sided with the liberals in passing this decision.
Last I checked, there was only one comment following mine; "Yeah, whatever."
Geez.
Dave
__________________
"When the lie is so big and the fog so thick, the Republican trick can play out again....."-------Frank Zappa
Last edited by BlueStreak; 07-01-2012 at 02:20 AM.
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07-01-2012, 07:52 AM
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Sonoma County, CA
Posts: 20,496
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueStreak
You would be amazed the people I heard bitching as they walked away from that play.....who did not get it....AT ALL. A man standing behind me mumbled, "You can't even escape the liberal bullshit in Williamsburg."
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Actually, this doesn't surprise me at all, Dave.
I wish it did but it doesn't.
John
Last edited by Boreas; 07-01-2012 at 09:26 AM.
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07-01-2012, 08:46 AM
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Derby City U.S.A.
Posts: 8,213
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You mean free speech applies to even words I don't want to hear or understand? What a concept, think it will ever catch on?
Barney
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07-01-2012, 09:20 AM
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Sonoma County, CA
Posts: 20,496
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oerets
You mean free speech applies to even words I don't want to hear or understand?
Barney
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Mostly, free speech applies to money. Everyone wants and understands money.
John
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07-01-2012, 09:55 AM
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Willamette Valley
Posts: 3,027
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The court made the correct ruling. I can claim all day long I'm a decorated war hero. Only when I start receiving monies, good or services for such claim, should I be prosecuted.
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"if men got pregnant, there would be a constitutional right to abortion on demand."
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07-01-2012, 01:24 PM
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Loyal Opposition
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Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Johnson County, Kansas
Posts: 14,401
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rex E.
The court made the correct ruling. I can claim all day long I'm a decorated war hero. Only when I start receiving monies, good or services for such claim, should I be prosecuted.
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Why did I take so many words to say that? Thanks for interpreting.
Regards,
D-Ray
__________________
Then I'll get on my knees and pray,
We won't get fooled again; Don't get fooled again
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